The Manosphere Report

0:00This is an iHeart Podcast.

0:02Guaranteed human. Come on. No!

0:06It's just a golf lesson, champ.

0:08Loosen up. I can't. See that Hyundai Santa Fe?

0:10Yeah. I only paid to now sell that.

0:13Finish up on your own.

0:15I gotta run. Deal's so right, it almost feels wrong.

0:17The Hyundai Getaway Sales Event.

0:19Get 0 % APR for 60 months, plus zero payments for 90 days on the

0:23Hyundai Tucson Tucson Hybrid, Santa Fe, or Santa Fe Hybrid.

0:27Now, during the Hyundai Getaway Sales Event.

0:29Hurry, offer ends March 31st.

0:31Call 562 -314 -4603 for details.

0:34Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it

0:38seriously. On Public, you can build a multi -asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto,

0:44and now generated assets, which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index

0:48with AI. It all starts with your prompt.

0:50From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over

0:5520 % year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI

0:59to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one -of -a -kind index, and

1:02lets you backtest it against the S &P 500.

1:05Then you can invest in a few clicks.

1:07Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis,

1:12not someone else's. Go to public .com slash podcast and earn an uncapped 1 %

1:16bonus when you transfer your portfolio.

1:18That's public .com slash podcast.

1:21Paid for by Public Investing.

1:22Brokered services by Open to the Public Investing, Inc., Member FINRA and SIPC, Advisory Services

1:25by Public Advisors, LLC, SEC Registered Advisor.

1:27Generated assets is an interactive analysis tool.

1:29Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice.

1:32Complete disclosures available at public .com slash disclosures.

1:36Your vehicle doesn't just get you from here to there.

1:39It's a bridge to the people and places that matter most.

1:43It's how you show up for your family, your community, and everyone else that depends

1:48on you. That's why for 125 years, Firestone has been building tires with one thing

1:54in mind. To deliver products that are as reliable as you are.

1:59Firestone. Always dependable. Since 1900.

2:05When you stay in your home, what you love gets to stay too.

2:09From the gardens that grow wild, to the grandkids that run wilder.

2:13From the Friday night baseball games, to the Sunday morning brunches.

2:17Even the daily crosswords. And weekly book clubs.

2:20There's room for it all with help from Home Instead.

2:24The largest in -home senior care network with over 30 years of trusted experience delivering

2:29the peace of mind you deserve.

2:31Visit Home Instead online for a better what's next.

2:35This is Bethany Frankel from Just Be with Bethany Frankel.

2:38Most dog food is marketing, not nutrition.

2:41That is why Biggie and Smalls eat just food for dogs.

2:45Real, 100 % human -grade food with ingredients I actually recognize.

2:51And yes, I do see the difference.

2:53Better digestion. Healthier skin. More energy.

2:56Dogs that feel better. My babies.

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3:03What's more important than your furry babies and their health?

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3:10No code needed. Just try it.

3:17Hey guys, we are back on normal.

3:20The show is normal. It takes for when the news gets weird.

3:22I'm Mary Catherine Ham. And I'm Carol Markowitz.

3:25Mary Catherine, our transcription service for this podcast has no idea what we're saying in

3:32the introduction. Who are these people?

3:34I'm hilariously wrong all the time.

3:38For some reason that, you know, I'm Mary Catherine Ham.

3:41I'm Carol Markowitz. It becomes like, I don't even know.

3:46We should start a thread on us of the different things it calls us.

3:52Yeah, it really, it's not even close.

3:55So I do enjoy that.

3:57The last one was, it had you saying, I'm normally, it's so, but normal.

4:02If it takes for women's game, weird.

4:05And mine was, I'm Mary Kay and I'm Carol Markowitz.

4:08How's it going, America Catherine?

4:11I think, you know what, if that's the AI, I feel okay for a little

4:16while still. Right. America Catherine, though, that's pretty good.

4:20Maybe I'll take that up.

4:21It's the 250th anniversary. It really is.

4:23Perhaps that's what I'll be this year.

4:25All right, America Catherine, let's get into it.

4:30Oh my goodness. The war in Iran continues, except that earlier today, President Trump said

4:36that he has ordered the strikes on Iran's energy facilities to be postponed for five

4:41days. Now, shortly after airing this information on Fox News, Trey Yenks, who delivered that

4:47information, then tweeted that Iran denied that they were in talks.

4:52He said, shortly after our report, Iranian state media denied the direct or indirect talks

4:58were taking place. U .S.

4:59officials say talks are happening.

5:01Iranian officials say they aren't.

5:04Yeah. So I don't know.

5:05We'll see what happens with that.

5:06But over the weekend, Iran fired two intermediate range ballistic missiles at Diego Garcia, which

5:12is a joint U .S.-U .K.

5:15military base about 4 ,000 kilometers away in the middle of the Indian Ocean.

5:21Now, what was really interesting about that, and you and I had a good time

5:25laughing about it. over the weekend was that there were several people who were really

5:30surprised that Iran had lied about their missile capabilities.

5:36You don't say. It's true.

5:40It turns out Iran is not telling the truth.

5:44And this was a shock to some people.

5:46Piers Morgan, our old friend Piers Morgan, who now, by the way, blocks me on

5:50X, which, you know, understandable.

5:52He tweeted, so not only has Iran brazenly lied about its ballistic missile range capacity,

5:58but this means it can probably hit the U .K.

6:01with them. And we have zero, I repeat, zero defense against these missiles.

6:06Very worrying. Yeah, that's what Donald Trump has been saying.

6:10That is worrisome. And that's what Marco Rubio was saying in 2015 when the first

6:16JCPOA Obama deal with Iran was made.

6:20And he's making these criticisms like, don't believe them about their missile capabilities.

6:25Don't give them more capabilities while we're at it.

6:28Don't believe them when they tell you under the deal that they're not improving their

6:32capabilities. And now we have concrete proof, which, although, as Piers notes, very worrisome, also

6:40shows the need for taking these capabilities out before they decide to go nuclear at

6:46some point. Yeah. Mike Cernovich, another X person, tweeted something similar.

6:52He said, Israel is far from perfect, but now everyone sees what Iran would do

6:56with more advanced weaponry. They're attacking Arab nations like a rabid dog.

7:00They had missiles that could reach Europe.

7:02They lied about everything. I said this to you in our personal text, but maybe

7:08it's the Russian in me.

7:09I just assume all of these regimes are lying.

7:12Why would you not? I just, it's so baffling to me.

7:15You know, going back to the Iraq war, which is what taints a lot of

7:19what we're doing today, because people are very gun shy, understandably, to get into a

7:24Middle Eastern entanglement. I fully understand.

7:27But even back then, Saddam Hussein lied about his weaponry.

7:32Now, he exaggerated it. He made him better than it was, he was still lying.

7:38And that's, you know, the crux of this thing where we cannot believe these people.

7:43We cannot trust these despots.

7:45Just can't rely on anything that they say.

7:47And that's the mode of operation that we should have here.

7:52Well, and you can't just hear what you want to hear, which was what Obama

7:56did far too often. They wanted to make this deal and they wanted to have

8:01a deal done just for the sake of having a deal done.

8:04And again, it also blows my mind that there was a revolution, an attempted one,

8:09an uprising in Iran during his first, Obama's first term.

8:15And then in the second term, he was like, yeah, I didn't help you guys

8:17with that. So what I'm going to do now is I'm going to help the

8:19mullahs continue for about 10 years to get closer to nuclear.

8:24And I'm also going to give them a bunch of money.

8:27And that he thought that that was going to do good.

8:30And they still claim that it did good, even though we now see what the

8:33capabilities are and that that money did not open opportunities for the Iranian people.

8:39Surprise, surprise. And against all of that evidence, Ben Rhodes continues to tweet that the

8:45JCPOA was the way to go.

8:47And I just completely disagree.

8:49As I have said in the past, you cannot gentle parent the Middle East and

8:52doing it with the mullahs is a bad idea.

8:55Yeah. I mean, it reminds me of that like pawn shop TV show where they're

8:59like, you know, we'd like a revolution.

9:01And Obama's like, the best I could do is pallets of cash for your oppressors.

9:05Let me serve that up.

9:07Yeah, it is. It's mystifying.

9:10And I do wonder, you know, does this long range or medium range strike or

9:15attempted strike mean that Iran is sort of flailing?

9:19It has seemed to be flailing since day one going after Arab states, solidifying, by

9:24the way, Arab state support, overt public support for this engagement by the U .S.

9:31and Israel, not silent behind the scenes like, OK, it's fine if you hit them.

9:35They are talking about it.

9:37So they have really solidified that support on our side.

9:41And this is maybe continued flailing because they are sort of trying to see what

9:46sticks to the wall, which is dangerous and also perhaps a clue that the 8000

9:51strikes we have made have made a difference.

9:53Right. At some point, we're going to have to see the Iranian people rise up

9:59and take over here because there is only so much we could do from the

10:03air. I don't want boots on the ground.

10:05I don't think anybody does.

10:07And it's funny, Trump keeps threatening that because it's a very Trumpy thing to do.

10:11Like all options are on the table, like we like to say about him.

10:14And, you know, it's also interesting because I think his primary pushback in the United

10:20States is this insane. I can't even call them right wing.

10:24I mean, on what planet are they right wing anymore?

10:26In the last few days, Tucker Carlson gave an interview to the very left wing

10:31economist magazine in the UK, and he was asked if the U .S.

10:35should share power with China.

10:37And he gave one of his like, of course, of course they should share power,

10:41baffled that anyone would oppose the U .S.

10:44and China being in some sort of power sharing relationship because America first now means,

10:49you know, being on equal footing with China, apparently.

10:52Yeah. And this is Yeah.

10:53the biggest kind of pushback that Trump has in the USA, because the Democrats are

10:58basically out of the picture.

11:00They're hardly talking about this more than just like, this isn't the way I would

11:04do it, but that's all they're doing.

11:07And yeah, so that's Trump's biggest political kind of hump here.

11:12Right. And as you say, in what way is that America first, that there's an

11:17authoritarian regime that very obviously wants to not be in a partnership with us, but

11:23dominate us. And we're like, yeah, I think I think we should do that because

11:28we wouldn't want to be a hegemon.

11:29That is like Howard Zinn stuff circa 2004.

11:34Even worse, really, because they're, you know, they keep pushing this thing like, oh, no,

11:40the Ayatollah said that there was a fatwa on nuclear weapons.

11:43Like, what? Why are you believing this?

11:46I mean, the the Iranians also told Al Jazeera this week that that missile strike

11:50was a false flag attack.

11:51Of course, we had nothing to do with that missile that came from Iran.

11:55So the fatwas and the official spokespeople of Iran.

12:00Sure. Go ahead and believe them with no with no grain of salt.

12:03Tune into the woke right as they completely eat that up and spit it out

12:07to their gullible audience. Along with the Obama bros, by the way, in case you

12:11want to see the horseshoe in action.

12:13Yep. So that's all the news we have about Iran.

12:15But we will continue to stay on this because it's obviously the biggest story around.

12:21I don't know. I don't know how much longer this lasts or if these talks

12:25are real. We're going to probably have a better picture by our Thursday episode.

12:31We're going to take a short break and be right back with more on normally.

12:36Come on. No. Oh, boy.

12:41Yeah, I know. My golf swing is off today.

12:44It's just a lesson. Who sent up, champ?

12:46I can't. I think I might have gotten away with something I shouldn't have.

12:49What the heck are you talking about?

12:51Okay, you see that brand new Hyundai Santa Fe over there?

12:54Yeah. Well, I only paid.

12:58Deal so right, it almost feels wrong.

13:01Get the Hyundai you've always wanted, plus America's best warranty, at the Hyundai Getaway Sales

13:05Event. Finish that bucket of balls on your own.

13:08I gotta run. Little Santa Fe's coming green, right?

13:11I love green. What? No.

13:14To come back, I paid for the full hour.

13:17It's a great day for a new Hyundai, at the Hyundai Getaway Sales Event.

13:20Going on now. Get 0 % APR for 60 months, plus zero payments for 90

13:25days on the Hyundai Tucson Tucson Hybrid, Santa Fe, or Santa Fe Hybrid.

13:29Now, during the Hyundai Getaway Sales Event.

13:31Hurry. Offer ends March 31st.

13:33Call 562 -314 -4603 for details.

13:37Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it

13:41seriously. On Public, you can build a multi -asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto,

13:46and now generated assets, which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index

13:50with AI. It all starts with your prompt.

13:52From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers, growing revenue over

13:5720 % year over year.

13:59You can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work.

14:02It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one -of -a -kind index, and lets you

14:05backtest it against the S &P 500.

14:07Then, you can invest in a few clicks.

14:09Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities.

14:12Completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's.

14:16Go to public .com slash podcast and earn an uncapped 1 % bonus when you

14:20transfer your portfolio. That's public .com slash podcast.

14:23Paid for by Public Investing.

14:24Brokered services by Open to the Public Investing, Inc., Member FINRA, and SIPC.

14:27Advisory services by Public Advisors, LLC, SEC Registered Advisor.

14:30Generated assets is an interactive analysis tool.

14:31Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice.

14:34Complete disclosures available at public .com slash disclosures.

14:38Your vehicle doesn't just get you from here to there.

14:41It's a bridge to the people and places that matter most.

14:46It's how you show up for your family, your community, and everyone else that depends

14:51on you. That's why for 125 years, Firestone has been building tires with one thing

14:57in mind, to deliver products that are as reliable as you are.

15:02Firestone, always dependable since 1900.

15:08Sometimes all we want is more of the same, like another round of golf played

15:12from a channel with 24 -7 coverage.

15:14Another look at the garden and the deer as they pick their way through it.

15:18Another Taco Tuesday, followed by a whatever's in the fridge Wednesday.

15:22And to get more of the same, all we need is a little help.

15:25With adaptable care plans from qualified, compassionate caregivers matched to your family's needs, Home Instead

15:30can help you and your passion stay home, no matter what's on your horizon.

15:34Visit Home Instead online for a better what's next.

15:37This is Bethany Frankel from Just Be with Bethany Frankel.

15:41Most dog food is marketing, not nutrition.

15:44That is why Biggie and Smalls eat just food for dogs, real, 100 % human

15:49-grade food with ingredients I actually recognize.

15:53And yes, I do see the difference.

15:55Better digestion, healthier skin, more energy, dogs that feel better.

16:00My babies. If you've been on the fence about switching, stop overthinking it.

16:05What's more important than your furry babies and their health?

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16:15All right, we are back on normally with a story out of Cuba.

16:20And it is of... Western influencers and political activists traveling to offer aid and comfort

16:27to commies, not to the normal people of Cuba who have been under the thumb

16:32of the commies for all these years.

16:33No, no, no. They claim to be offering aid and support in light of the

16:36U .S. embargo, because, of course, it's the U .S.

16:39that's the problem in Cuba.

16:40And they're showing up, of course, with regime approval.

16:45They are staying in nice hotels.

16:47Well, Medea Benjamin, head of Code Pink, filmed herself in a first class seat talking

16:53about how she was going to Cuba.

16:55And I thought, aren't you supposed to be an economy?

16:58Isn't in your world, isn't there only economy seating?

17:02But just like most socialists of note, she ends up getting the good stuff while

17:06everybody else gets stuck in the back.

17:08Membership has its privileges. And now they were down in Cuba saving the day, I

17:12suppose. Right, Carol? Apparently. I mean, I've heard that they've done some really amazing humanitarian

17:17work. Was there a mural involved?

17:20Yes. We have some tape of some Code Pink folks painting a mural for the

17:25people of Havana, which should fix the grid problems in no time.

17:29I am hoping to leave a gift and vision of humanidad.

17:34This is the mural for humanity.

17:37And it's going to have little boats with notes in it of love.

17:43I didn't offer you that.

17:43And it will make you back the words.

17:45Yeah, I walk all the way to the bird on the other side.

17:48There'll be fishes and sea life here.

17:52And it's from a poem with artists from all over the United States.

17:57Oh, my God. The kefias that they're wearing.

18:00These are the biggest clowns in the world.

18:02And they like that these people in Cuba are suffering under communism.

18:08They like that they're continuing to put up a fight and say, you know, an

18:13ideology that's been dead essentially for like 30 years, the Cubans still continue to live

18:18under. And these people go there and act like just poverty tourists.

18:23Look at how terrible their lives are.

18:25But at least they have really high literacy rate.

18:29And it's just it's pathetic and sad that they don't want the Cuban people to

18:35have a better life because it fits in with their ideology, which is hating America

18:40and wanting America to fail.

18:42And so if America has this example of a communist country at their doorstep, you

18:47know, quote unquote, succeeding, I would say just surviving and barely.

18:51Um, then that's all they really want to see.

18:55Can we talk about artist solidarity for a second?

18:58Because these are all these artists who are traveling down, including Hassan Piker, who hosts

19:02all of the 2028 hopefuls for the Democratic Party podcast or streamer.

19:07These are all like, you know, free speech beneficiaries and art, free art beneficiaries who

19:13travel down there to visit a regime that is right now.

19:17And this is just one of hundreds and thousands of political prisoners.

19:20But right now, imprisoning for nine years, a reggaeton artist who had the crime of

19:25recording a uprising anthem called Patria Evita, which is a reversal of the regime's slogan,

19:34which is homeland or death.

19:36This is home and life.

19:38And he has been in jail for several years now, probably not humanely.

19:44Right. And he's a political prisoner for his beliefs and for his art.

19:48And this reggaeton artist, and I believe there's one more who recorded it with him.

19:53They get no mention by any of these folks, the artistes who travel down to

19:58make murals. I mean, it's just ridiculous.

20:00Yeah. But has the guy in prison heard about the literacy rate?

20:03Because maybe that would change his perspective a little.

20:07I was listening to a Cuban -American talk about this, and she was like, people

20:11train to swim from Cuba, not just to Florida, but to Gitmo.

20:17They want to get to the land of Gitmo, which is the land of promise

20:21compared to Cuba. And like, in that situation, no, no, you idiots, you useful idiots.

20:28This is not the land that you have romanticized with its 50s cars, which, by

20:33the way, exists because they've existed in the 50s since 1957.

20:37Yeah. Not to be cool.

20:38It's because it's all they have.

20:40Yeah. Yeah. You know, we finally finished Miracle on Ice.

20:44I know. It takes us forever to watch a movie as a family.

20:46We watch it like half an hour at a time.

20:48What an ending, really. So good.

20:50The movie, they mentioned the Berlin Wall, which got us talking with the kids about

20:54what that was and when it came down and all of that.

20:58And it's making the very obvious point that all the defections were only going in

21:04one direction. There were no defections going the opposite way.

21:08I mean, look, there were people who went to the Soviet Union and regretted it

21:11very much during that whole period.

21:14But the open defections were never going to be like the U .S.

21:19hockey players. Like, I have to stay here.

21:22It's just never. And there's a real good reason for that.

21:26So I think in the same way that I didn't think it was worth for

21:32Ron DeSantis to debate Gavin Newsom because the debate had already happened in real life

21:36and Florida won. I think in the exact same way, capitalism won, freedom won, democracy

21:42won. The argument has been over for such a long time.

21:46These people are just hanging on to something that doesn't exist.

21:49more yeah i think to me unfortunately you have to keep debating it to some

21:53extent because younger people are just like that sounds neat and it's like look westerners

21:59uh i encourage you if you want to join la revolución it's happening 90 miles

22:04south of here and you can have no streaming and no posting to instagram because

22:09uh and you can have rationed food and rationed health care and all those things

22:12you can experience those in real life by just going 90 miles and yet they

22:17still live here yep yep and everybody comes in this direction yeah but yeah it's

22:23you're not going to convince lifelong communists but i guess it's worth convincing the younger

22:29generations that free stuff is not ever actually free it really isn't we're gonna take

22:35a short break and be right back with more on normally come on no oh

22:45boy yeah i know my golf swing is off today it's just a lesson who

22:49sent up champ i can't i think i might have gotten away with something i

22:52shouldn't have the heck are you talking about okay you see that brand new hyundai

22:56santa fe over there yeah well i only paid deal so right it almost feels

23:04wrong get the hyundai you've always wanted plus america's best warranty at the hyundai getaway

23:09sales event finish that bucket of balls on your own i gotta run little santa

23:13fe's coming green right i love green what no what to come back i paid

23:18for the full hour it's a great day for a new hyundai at the hyundai

23:23getaway sales event going on now get zero percent apr for 60 months plus zero

23:28payments for 90 days on the hyundai tucson tucson hybrid santa fe or santa fe

23:32hybrid now during the hyundai getaway sales event hurry offer ends march 31st call 562

23:38-314 -4603 for details support for the show comes from public the investing platform for

23:44those who take it seriously on public you can build a multi -asset portfolio of

23:48stocks bonds options crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea

23:53into an investable index with ai it all starts with your prompt from renewable energy

23:57companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20 percent year

24:02over year you can literally type any prompt and put the ai to work it

24:06screens thousands of stocks builds a one -of -a -kind index and lets you backtest

24:09it against the s &p 500 then you can invest in a few clicks generated

24:13assets are like etfs with infinite possibilities completely customizable and based on your thesis not

24:19someone else's go to public .com slash podcast and earn an uncapped one percent bonus

24:23when you transfer your portfolio that's public .com slash podcast paid for by public investing

24:28brokerage services by open to the public investing inc member finra and sipc advisory services

24:31by public advisors llc sec registered advisor generated assets is an interactive analysis tool output

24:35is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice complete disclosures

24:39available at public .com slash disclosures your vehicle doesn't just get you from here to

24:45there it's a bridge to the people and places that matter most it's how you

24:50show up for your family your community and everyone else that depends on you that's

24:56why for 125 years firestone has been building tires with one thing in mind to

25:02deliver products that are as reliable as you are firestone always dependable since 1900 when

25:12you stay in your home what you love gets to stay too from the gardens

25:16that grow wild to the grandkids that run wilder from the friday night baseball games

25:21to the sunday morning brunches even the daily crosswords and weekly book clubs there's room

25:27for it all with help from home instead the largest in -home senior care network

25:32with over 30 years of trusted experience delivering the peace of mind you deserve visit

25:38home instead online for a better what's next this is bethany frankel from just be

25:43with bethany frankel most dog food is marketing not nutrition that is why biggie and

25:49smalls eat just food for dogs real 100 human grade food with ingredients i actually

25:56recognize and yes i do see the difference better digestion healthier skin more energy dogs

26:03that feel better my babies if you've been on the fence about switching stop overthinking

26:09it what's more important than your furry babies and their health go to just food

26:12for dogs dot com right now and get 50 off your first box no code

26:16needed just try it all right we are back on normally with some talk about

26:22people who are not normal and about whom i feel like i know far too

26:26much at this point and that's polyamorists yeah the polyamorists are at it again carol

26:31which it's like vegetarian crossfit polyamorists like you're gonna find out in the first five

26:37minutes for sure and what we have now is a new memoir called adult braces

26:42by a woman named lindy west who formerly had gotten some fame with another memoir

26:47that was a became a tv show at one point and this is about how

26:53she was in a marriage the man named aham who then decided he didn't want

26:57to be in a monogamous relationship anymore and so he convinced her that they should

27:02be polyamorous and that she he should have a girlfriend and that not only that

27:06she should like live in the guest room sometimes so that he could be with

27:10the girlfriend and this is all presented by her as a very uplifting experience right

27:17but but to reviewers and most readers it seems it is presented in a way

27:22that makes them go oh girl right that's the thing is that this is a

27:28book about how happy she is to be in a polyamorous relationship and i don't

27:32think the the guest room is sometimes but i could i could be wrong on

27:35that from what the question i got was the girlfriend now lives in the bedroom

27:39and she lindy west is in the guest room but it's okay because they like

27:44tuck her in at night and like baby and she loves that but it is

27:49the thing is that everybody who reads this book and i admittedly have not but

27:54i've read all the discourse around it just does not believe her and that's a

27:59real problem for a memoir if you're writing a memoir and people are saying i

28:04don't buy any of this they just don't trust your own version of your life

28:08and i'm sure it's uh you know annoying to her because apparently she is very

28:14annoyed but there's something to that and she should really maybe think about that well

28:19there was another uh memoir of polyamorism uh recently called molly it was molly roden

28:26winter was the writer it was called more and she was in the same it

28:30had the same vibe and the vibe is that in every story of polyamory which

28:34is they attempt to mainstream constantly is it was the the elite media in general

28:40uh every time there's a person involved who is long suffering long struggling who has

28:47been admonished that they should get into this that that if they don't that their

28:52thinking is backwards and dare i say conservative because they want one partner right and

28:57they wrestle with their own issues with this and their insecurities and you have constant

29:02back and forth and check -ins with your partner about what the boundaries are and

29:06the boundary is just old -fashioned the boundary is that you should be with one

29:09person and that would make you happier but they overcome their own issues with it

29:15to acquiesce to their partner's desires and it looks like just long -term emotional abuse

29:20to me absolutely yeah that's the feeling i get for most polyamorous stories but what

29:27i would say about lindy is that it even goes beyond that so in the

29:31atlantic a writer named helen lewis reviewed the book and just all the stuff around

29:36lindy west this is the part that really caught my attention she writes even her

29:41relationship wasn't all that it seemed in her 2019 essay collection the witches are coming

29:46she had written that she and ulu that's her husband's last name her quote -unquote

29:50best friend and a quote -unquote once -in -a -generation musical talent had a dawn

29:55ritual where they lay in bed talking for hours and as i'm as i'm reading

29:59this i'm like that's very nice that's i my husband and i don't have a

30:02dawn ritual where we lay in bed talking for hours so uh lewis goes on

30:07in adult braces lindy adds that what i admitted is that we only developed that

30:12ritual to mitigate a toxic pattern we'd been stuck in for years i'd wake up

30:17anxious i'd vomit my anxiety on ahem he'd snap at me for triggering his anxiety

30:23i'd feel alone and unsupported i'd stare at him with tears in my eyes until

30:27he had a panic attack he'd zone out for the rest of the day and

30:31not listen to a word i said like ma 'am that is very very different

30:35than the dawn ritual of laying in bed talking for hours like one is just

30:40clearly a lie yes that's what you do but the conversation is brutal and horrible

30:46yes and the by the way the the idea of going back and forth about

30:50this terribleness over and over again it's just like like maybe you're not dealing with

30:55the root of the problem which is that there are several people in this relationship

30:58and at least one of you guys probably doesn't really want to be there yeah

31:02um uh i recommend that helen lewis article by the way even if you're not

31:07at all interested in this lindy west story because it is also about and she

31:12titles it the death of millennial feminism i'd say it's not specifically millennial feminism that

31:18died here it's really wokeness woke culture and lewis does a really good job of

31:23writing out what was so annoying about it and why it couldn't survive and why

31:28it pushed people like her away um tyler harper austin who also writes for the

31:33atlantic uh had a piece on this and we spoke just now about the horseshoe

31:37horseshoe theory on iran and he touches on something that kind of amuses me about

31:41these polyamorous which is that they end up making their own sexual relationships this political

31:46project uh he he writes that um west's devotion to aham also made me think

31:51of a different sort of wife one whom west herself would most likely object to

31:55being compared to the right -wing trad wife who treats her husband as if he

31:59was a god and says submit to him indeed in many ways west's performatively anti

32:04-white unpatriotic and cosmopolitan version of polyamory is the blue state mirror image of tradwifery

32:09which in its various forms blah blah blah he says such a you know both

32:15romantic trends have adherents who spin their retreat from status quo romance as a kind

32:18of liberation from modern expectations and who position their marital arrangement as the logical extension

32:23of a deeper political project so we have this horseshoe effect going on here too

32:28and in both it's like you're creating a product and sort of telling everyone how

32:34great it is when the the lived experience of it looks very different to everyone

32:40even from your explaining of it yeah and that's also why you I think it's

32:45so hard for people to believe that marriage and children is a fulfilling, happy, you

32:51know, path in life. Like all these young people don't believe it.

32:54And I think partly it's because they get lied to in these memoirs and they

32:57could tell. And they're like, everything is a lie.

33:00And, you know, we talk about that a lot on here, too, how when a

33:03lot of things are a lie, people stop believing everything.

33:07The Cut, by the way, ran a piece, too.

33:09It was like, could opening your marriage lighten your mental load?

33:13Answer, no. No, it will not.

33:16Like, you'd rather just do more laundry than do that, I promise you.

33:21And indeed, in that piece, at the end, you find out this.

33:25In this case, it's a woman who wanted to open her marriage.

33:27And you find out at the end that there was a man who she talked

33:30into it who was like, confesses eventually to not feeling very comfortable with it.

33:34It's like, yeah, don't do that to your partner.

33:37Yeah, it seems like it should be an easy call.

33:39Don't get talked into having a side person in your relationship.

33:44But, you know, what do we know?

33:46We were just going by thousands of years of history.

33:50Somebody tweeted, I wish I could reference it specifically, but tweeted that, like, there's been

33:54a 10 -year project on polyamory to convince you that being normal and married and

34:00raising some kids would not make you happy, when in fact, it'll probably make you

34:04happy. Like, I could just do that.

34:06There's, like, a lot of evidence throughout history that it does make you happy.

34:11This new thing, though, there's no evidence yet that it makes anybody happy.

34:15And, you know, the show Arrested Development had this great part where this couple was

34:20talking about opening their marriage.

34:21And he says, you know, something like, oh, you know, a lot of people do

34:25it. And the wife says, does it work for them?

34:28And he says, no, but we could be the first.

34:31Good luck. Yeah. Good luck with that.

34:34And thanks for joining us on Normally, Normally airs Tuesdays and Thursdays.

34:39And you can subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts.

34:41Get in touch with us at normallythepod at gmail .com.

34:45Thanks for listening. And when things get weird, act normally.

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Normally Podcast: Iran Escalation, Cuba’s Socialist Illusions & The Collapse of Polyamory Culture