The Manosphere Report

0:01Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

0:03The Joe Rogan Experience. Showing by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day.

0:13How are you, sir? Pleasure to meet you.

0:14It's great to be here.

0:15Thanks for having me. Great to be back in Texas.

0:17I'm glad we finally did this.

0:19Yes, me too. I wanted to do it the first go around.

0:21Yeah, I know. Well, when I got the invitation, we were in the middle of

0:25the election, and we just don't leave the country during election campaigns.

0:29I get it. And the problem we've had is we can't get you to come

0:31to Canada, and so we've actually hatched a full strategy to get you into Canada,

0:37because we think it's going to do big things for our tourism numbers.

0:41So do you mind if I present you with something right out of the gate?

0:43Sure. All right. This is from a gunsmith and machinist in Calgary, Alberta.

0:49His name is Jay, and he's designed a...

0:52Look at this kettlebell. Guess what the weight is?

0:5670 pounds? 70 pounds. That's the weight you have.

0:58And it says on the front here, Jamie...

1:00It says here on the front, Jamie, pull it up.

1:03So you've got that. We've got...

1:05Let me see here. Some other stuff for a stand.

1:09Oh, wow. That's really cool.

1:11Look at this stand here.

1:12So we've got seeing is believing, which I think was the slogan of the first

1:16UFC that you were the commentator for.

1:19I think it was number 13?

1:2012. Number 12, right. And then we've got here your favorite quote from, what's his

1:29name? The Japanese martial artist.

1:30Miyamoto Musashi? Yes. And it says, if you know the weight broadly, you will see

1:35it in everything. Yeah. So that's here.

1:37And then Morse code, there's a thank you letter for you.

1:40And we've got... You've got your flying saucer.

1:43Oh, wow. And we've got your logo here, too.

1:45So, but most important of all, we've got a subliminal message, which is the Canadian

1:49maple leaf. Oh, cool. So every time you do a kettlebell swing, you do a

1:54snatch, you do a clean, you're going to be seeing that maple leaf, and you're

1:59going to be reminding yourself that you need to come back to Canada.

2:01All right. All right. All right.

2:02I'll present that to you there.

2:05Thank you very much. Very cool.

2:08Is that in the way, Jamie?

2:09I can take it off.

2:10We'll take it off. I'll just pick it up.

2:13Here, put it down here.

2:16So, I saw your interview with Pavel, and I'm a big kettlebell freak.

2:22Are you really? Yeah, absolutely.

2:23And I started researching him after you had him on, and I was trying to...

2:27I love history. So, I was thinking, why did the Russians come up with this?

2:32And it turns out they used it as a counterweight at the farmer markets.

2:36So, they would say, you know, you come in, you have to say, this is

2:39how much potatoes you're buying, but instead of trying to do it by eyeball, they

2:43would put what is now kettlebell on one side of the scale, and then the

2:47produce on the other. And then at the farmer's expeditions, you had these big Russian

2:52farmers who wanted to show how strong they were.

2:54So, they would pick them up and do all kinds of displays with them.

2:58And then the Russian army took it on, the Soviet army took it on, and

3:03then that's where Pavel picked it up and then brought it over the Atlantic and

3:07introduced it to America. Wow, that's crazy.

3:09So, it was just accidental that they made this very functional tool for fitness?

3:14Yeah. It was just, you'd go to a farmer's market, you want to buy some

3:17barley or some potatoes, but you don't know if you're actually getting the real weight.

3:22So, they'd have a scale, a balancing scale, and they'd put the kettlebell on one

3:25side and the produce on the other, and then you knew you got the right

3:28amount. And then, of course, they have these big farmers, farm fairs, and they're showing

3:33off their horses and their cattle and stuff, and they'd want to do strength displays.

3:37So, these farmers are throwing these things around, and the Russian military picked it up,

3:42and then the Soviets, of course, took over and they took it on.

3:45And then Pavel, I think he was a Belarusian, though, if I'm not mistaken, Pavel.

3:49So, Sessulin, and he brought it over to North America, but the ancient Chinese did

3:56it as well. You got...

3:58Really? Yeah, the ancient Chinese, the Shaolin monks have used them, but they didn't do

4:01it with cast iron. They had, theirs were sort of a concrete, a concrete block,

4:05and they did it for strength training as well.

4:08Oh, wow. A little history.

4:10Yeah, so I'm a big kettlebell freak.

4:12I love it. And I really, I started to study what Pavel's teaching.

4:16I wanted, I think he has an accreditation or something.

4:18If I ever get time, I might take it.

4:19Yeah, Strong First. Yeah. That's his organization.

4:23And you're doing, you have a whole program, I think, you do clean to press

4:28and then... Yeah, I do a bunch of different things.

4:30Squats with overhead squat and all that.

4:32It's a great functional tool just for your whole body.

4:36Right. You know, it's really one of the best pieces of exercise equipment I think

4:40I've ever found. Yeah, I think he calls it a cannonball on a handle.

4:46And the thing I like about it is the, it's like a catapult.

4:51Like it, all of the lift is in that instant where it flips over your

4:55hand. Mm -hmm. And, oh, there you go.

4:57Oh, so these are the original ones.

4:58Wow. That's crazy. That's so interesting.

5:02So the handle was just to pick it up and carry it around.

5:04Yeah. Wow. So it had a real functional use.

5:08Well, it's just amazing how good it is for a piece of exercise equipment that

5:13was accidentally designed that way.

5:16Absolutely. And I think it's far superior to a dumbbell exercise because there's no, a

5:23dumbbell, you get a consistent lift, but that's not real life.

5:26If you're in a fight or you have to pick something up heavy, it doesn't

5:30lift consistently. It's explosive in that small range.

5:34And, you know, when you're doing a snatch, by the time you get up to

5:38your shoulder, the thing's weightless because the catapult effect has taken over.

5:42And now it's actually negative weights lifting your hand up in the air if you're

5:45doing it right. But, like, if you're in a fight or if you're in a

5:49wrestling match or you're trying to push really hard against a heavy object, it's all

5:53about explosive power. And that's what kettlebells give rather than just this sort of freeze

5:59and contract thing that you do with dumbbells.

6:02Have you always been a workout guy?

6:04Yeah, look, I was big into sports until my mid -teens.

6:08I was on the wrestling team.

6:10It wasn't great. I was good, but I wasn't great.

6:12Then I got a wicked tendinitis in my shoulder, and it ended my athleticism for

6:19like four years, and that's how it got into politics.

6:20I was so bored. I got to get home from school.

6:22I had nothing to do, so I told my mother.

6:25Tendinitis got you into politics?

6:27Yeah, that's what it was.

6:29I just couldn't get rid of it.

6:31Every time I thought I had it beat, I'd go in and I'd train, and

6:34it would be full of inflammation.

6:36No one could do anything about it.

6:37And so I was bored out of my mind, and I said to my mom,

6:41you go to these local meetings with the conservative association.

6:45Take me to that because I'm going crazy.

6:48That's nuts. So what were you interested in when you first went there?

6:54We just didn't like the way things were running.

6:58What was it about it that got you so curious?

7:03Well, I grew up in a suburban neighborhood in South End of Calgary.

7:09You know, my folks were teachers.

7:11I was adopted. My mom was a 16 -year -old.

7:14She was obviously a single mom.

7:16She put me up for adoption to two school teachers.

7:18There was electricians and oil workers and police officers who lived on our street, normal,

7:22hardworking, good folks. And I always grew up with the impression they were getting screwed

7:26over and that the government didn't listen to people like them, didn't listen to people

7:32who grew up on streets like ours.

7:34And living in Western Canada, there was a greater sense of that.

7:38We called it Western alienation at the time.

7:40And there was this guy, kind of a quirky guy, but a really brilliant guy

7:44named Preston Manning. And I saw this billboard of him, and he had his fist

7:48up, and it said, enough.

7:49And I said, yeah, I like that guy.

7:51So I got involved in politics.

7:53And I started reading about different things.

7:56I read a biography on Fidel Castro, and then I read some more.

8:00Justin's dad. No, no, no, not Justin's dad.

8:03Right? No, no, no. No?

8:05No. Are you sure? His dad was Pierre.

8:07His dad was Pierre. His dad was Pierre.

8:09I had issues with Pierre Trudeau, too.

8:11It is a great conspiracy theory, though.

8:13Well, it is a hell of a...

8:15I don't think it's a true one, though.

8:16His dad is Pierre. His dad was very controversial when I grew up, because he

8:21did a lot of damage to the oil sector, and we're from oil country.

8:24And so that was one of the things that I felt kind of resentful about

8:27the national government. And one of the reasons I got involved is because the West

8:33deserved a fairer deal. But I read a lot of books, like Milton Friedman, Capitalism

8:39and Freedom, and I came to develop a philosophy.

8:43Based on just maximizing personal, financial, religious freedom.

8:48Let people make their own decisions.

8:50And that animated me to get involved in politics and fight for that, and I've

8:54been doing it ever since.

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9:36Eastern time, 5 p .m.

9:38Pacific time. Oh, that's a fascinating transition from wrestling and tendinitis getting deeply involved in

9:45politics. Yeah, I mean, like, you know, you're a sports guy.

9:49If you had suffered an injury that took you out of Taekwondo when you were

9:53young and you simply couldn't compete at anything, you'd probably be looking for some other

9:57adventure. Yeah, we should have.

10:00Well, we're lucky that stem cells weren't around back then or you never would have

10:03gotten into politics. That's right.

10:05I would have been a wrestler.

10:06I don't know if I would have won any awards.

10:08But, yeah, that was how I got started, and I got very active very quickly.

10:15I got my first internship making $600 a month when I was 16 or 17

10:21years old. And, you know, take two trains and a bus in an hour and

10:2645 minutes each way. But I was so thrilled.

10:28My dad bought me a used suit and a used pair of shoes.

10:31And I thought, this is so incredible.

10:33I'm an important guy. I wear dress shoes.

10:35I wear a tie. It didn't matter that the tie was bought from some dead

10:39guy whose family had sold it to a used store.

10:42But that was my start, and I loved it.

10:46Well, I'm really excited to have you in here because I've seen you speak multiple

10:50times, and you're a very reasonable, intelligent person that makes a lot of sense.

10:56And that is a rare thing in politics.

11:00And I love Canada. Like, I just say, I don't go up there anymore, but

11:05it's because I think the government went horribly wrong over the last, you know, X

11:10amount of years. But the people are amazing.

11:13It's like, I've always said that Canada has, like, it's like America with, like, 20

11:17% less assholes. Like, every time I would go up there, I'm like, people are

11:22so nice. They're, like, the nicest people.

11:24And I think that's part of what went wrong for Canada is that people are

11:30rule followers, and, you know, they're trusting and kind people.

11:35And, you know, this wolf in sheep's clothing snuck in and, you know, was pretending

11:41he was a sweet guy and passing all these crazy laws.

11:44And just when we saw what happened with COVID, with just what happened with the

11:49truckers and people's accounts getting shut down for donating to the truckers, like, the whole

11:55thing was so concerning because Canada was, like, a part of America almost.

12:01I mean, you're a different country, but it's, like, you used to be able to

12:04go over there with just a driver's license, you know?

12:06It was, like, it was such a cool place.

12:08I started going to the Montreal Comedy Festival in, like, 1993.

12:12I loved it up there.

12:13It's, like, one of my favorite places to be.

12:15Is it just for laughs?

12:16Just pour vivre? Yeah. Good.

12:17How's your French? Not good.

12:19Okay, we'll work on that.

12:20We'll get you some French lessons.

12:22It's terrible. I don't know any French words.

12:24My wife is learning French, though.

12:26It's interesting. She's got this app that she's learning French.

12:29But it's just an amazing place.

12:31It's a great country. And to see it go the way it's been going and

12:37sliding the way it's been happening over the last X amount of years, there's just

12:43so many things that concern me.

12:45One of the things that really concerns me is this assisted suicide thing.

12:50Had one in 20 deaths in Canada is now assisted suicide.

12:54That's insane. Well, listen, my view is that people should have the choice.

13:00But the concern we have is the suggestion that it would be offered to kids

13:05or offered to people whose only condition is mental illness.

13:09I don't agree with that.

13:11My concern as well. I mean, if someone's got a terminal, like a good friend

13:14of mine went to Oregon to end his life because he had ALS.

13:18But, I mean, he was gone.

13:20I mean, he could barely talk at the end of his life.

13:23His name is Michael Lehrer.

13:23He was a regular guest on Kill Tony.

13:26Great guy. And it was horrible.

13:29I mean, watching him fade away.

13:31And he wanted to go out on his own terms.

13:33So he went to Oregon for assisted suicide.

13:36I mean, there's a place for it.

13:37But, I mean, there was a kid recently in Canada, and he did it for

13:42seasonal depression. I'm sure you're aware of that case.

13:46I am. Like, who allowed that to happen?

13:49Who didn't counsel this young guy?

13:50Who didn't give him a hug?

13:52Who didn't tell him about diet and exercise and changing your surroundings, your lifestyle?

13:58Just do something. Right. To give you some hope and happiness.

14:00Like, seasonal depression? I know.

14:03You're going to end your life, this beautiful life on this planet, for seasonal depression?

14:08That's crazy. And that's why we have to do more to give people hope when

14:11they're suffering with mental illness.

14:13Yes. You know, give people the sense that they can take back control of their

14:17lives. I think we do have to promote fitness more because it gives people, it

14:21turns them into a subject that controls their surroundings rather than an object being controlled.

14:27It teaches people that hardship is temporary and that the aftermath is positive.

14:33And we have to give people, reinstill people with a sense of meaning when they're

14:37going through hardship rather than to say that it's all over.

14:41And, you know, I think we have to, our system needs to be geared towards

14:46giving people all the best options to live on rather than just suggesting MAID as

14:52the easy, as the automatic path for the system to impose on people.

14:58So one of the things our party is pushing for is to make clear that

15:02public servants who are getting phone calls from people who are in need of help

15:05for something, they shouldn't be offering that.

15:09They shouldn't be offering MAID.

15:10People can seek it out if they want, but when you're calling up saying I'm

15:14poor or I'm struggling or I'm having a mental illness or I've got an injury,

15:19we shouldn't have a government worker saying, well, consider MAID.

15:23Well, the unfortunate thing is that any organization that gets formed wants to grow.

15:30And you get financial incentives and then you hire more people and then it gets

15:37bigger and then what do you have to do?

15:39Well, you have to keep doing what you're doing.

15:40Exactly. What are you doing?

15:41You're killing people. So you're going to kill more people because you're actually financially incentivized

15:46to put more people through this program and end their lives.

15:50That's very sad. I think we have to get to a point where people have

15:53the freedom to make their own decisions, but they also have hope that there is

15:56an option for them. Yeah, give them a pathway.

15:59You know, and like the exercise thing, it's not just give them, you know, control

16:04of their life. It makes them happier.

16:06There's been studies that show it's much more effective than antidepressants.

16:10Absolutely. Well, first of all, there's the physiological side, which affects the brain, but it's

16:15also the sensation of discomfort that you push through, knowing that you have to focus

16:21on the thing you have to do.

16:23And that, I think, it helps us in anything we're encountering, whether you're going through

16:28a divorce or a bankruptcy or an injury or an illness, if you know that

16:33pushing through to the other side because you've got a meaning there, that can give

16:37people hope for a better life.

16:39You know, my favorite psychologist is Viktor Frankl, and he developed this Lagos treatment, which

16:46was basically giving people a sense of meaning.

16:50He survived the Holocaust in the concentration camp because he had a sense of meaning

16:54that he wanted to, his book was stolen from him in the concentration camp about

16:59this theory. And he wanted to live on so he could survive and write that

17:04book. And then he found in his teaching that it wasn't so much people's circumstances

17:11that determined their happiness. It was whether they had a meaning in life.

17:14And he tells this incredible story of a group therapy session where he had this

17:18very rich woman who was married to a very rich man.

17:21And he had next to him another lady who was living in terrible poverty.

17:25She'd lost a son and had a second severely disabled son.

17:28And he said to both of them, what will your life look like when you're

17:3180 years old and you're on your deathbed?

17:33And the wealthier lady said, well, I will look back and think that I had

17:38some fun and enjoyed the luxuries of being very wealthy and having an easy life

17:44that there wasn't a lot of meaning to it.

17:46And whereas the mother who was struggling with a disabled child and had lost another

17:50one said, well, I gave my first child a great life, a short one, but

17:54a great one. I struggled to give my disabled child a good, dignified existence.

18:00And I leave this world satisfied and happy that my life had purpose and meaning.

18:05And the lesson that I take from that is that it is not about whether

18:09you have a gazillion dollars or whether your life is easy.

18:12It's whether you have some meaning to invest your life into.

18:15And I think we have to infuse people's lives with meaning so that they can

18:20live a good life. Well, that's a great message.

18:23And I think it's one of the most important parts of being a leader is

18:29having a great message and having a great philosophy and having a great perspective.

18:33And I mean, that's what disturbed me the most about when true.

18:39I was running the country that I didn't feel like, I felt like he was

18:42manipulating people with woke politics and ideology and that it was just this weird slippery

18:48slope that people were falling down where they're losing rights and you're losing your ability

18:53to express yourself and it just really disturbed me because I always felt that Canada

18:58was like one of the freest places and one of the most open -minded places

19:03and it just, I didn't understand how it could fall so quickly.

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20:05We, we still, you know, we are a free country and we, we are a

20:08democracy. We have preserved that.

20:11Um, you know, my leader, my, I had this funny moment when Joe Biden came

20:14to parliament Hill and I said, uh, uh, Mr.

20:17President, I'm Pierre Polyev. I'm the leader of his majesty's loyal opposition.

20:22And he said, loyal opposition.

20:24How can you be loyal and opposition at the same time?

20:27It's like, what the hell are you talking about?

20:29And because you guys have a system based on the Republic, whereas ours is the

20:34British system. And in our system, that the opposition is an act of loyalty.

20:41That's what our system, it means that if you are opposing the government, you're doing

20:47it out of loyalty to the good of the people.

20:49And our house of commons, you have a half circle in your Congress.

20:52We have two sides in our parliament.

20:54It's two and a half sword lengths apart because they used to literally kill each

20:57other in the old English days.

20:59But the idea is the opposition is to prosecute the hell out of the government,

21:03make the mighty low. The most powerful people in the country are supposed to tremble

21:07every time they walk in that place because no, every mistake they made, every abuse

21:11of power, every corruption they might've done can be exposed and in front of all

21:16eyes. So our system is really designed to constrain the power of government through what

21:22we call parliament. Like I don't work for government.

21:24I work for parliament and parliament works for the people.

21:26We call it the house of commons because the, it's the house of the common

21:30people. It's green in there because they used to meet in the, in the fields

21:33of England. And so I really view the world of our parliament to limit the

21:38power of government, to maximize the power of the people, make people bigger, stronger, and

21:43more fulfilled by having the government narrowly focus on the, on the things it's supposed

21:48to do. Roads, military, basic social safety net, borders, police, et cetera, but then leave

21:54people alone to live their lives.

21:56If I were to start a political party from scratch, it would be the mind,

21:59your own damn business party.

22:01You know, just get the government to do its job well, do, you know, do

22:04four or five things really well, and then let people live their lives.

22:08Well, that sounds very reasonable.

22:10Yeah. Yeah. I mean, anybody that doesn't go along with that, anybody that's opposed to

22:14that, that doesn't even make sense.

22:16No, look, like I said, the way I grew up and everything I've seen ever

22:20since, when I talk to farmers or factory workers, electricians, I find they know just

22:28as much or more than the so -called experts I encounter on parliament hill.

22:33Like back during COVID, when all these governments were printing money, uh, and all the

22:37politicians and bankers said, oh, this is great.

22:40Uh, we'll look at all this money we get to spend.

22:42I walk around communities and I'd have like mechanics say, you know, we're going to

22:45have inflation. And I would say, yeah, it makes sense to me.

22:49And I'd go back to parliament hill and the experts would all say, no, no,

22:52there's not going to be any inflation.

22:53And sure enough, all that money filtered into the economy, bid up all the goods

22:57we buy and, and everybody got smoked with higher prices.

23:01But the point is that it was the, it was the common people who don't

23:04study this stuff for a living, who don't read endless reports and studies who could

23:09just figure out that if there's money pouring into the economy, that's not matched by

23:13goods and services, it's going to bid up the cost of everything.

23:16So that's my experience. And my lot, my ideology is the common guy knows how

23:20to make his own decisions.

23:21We need to empower him to do that.

23:24Yeah. Just stay out of people's lives.

23:25Exactly. So there's a narrative in America and the narrative is that you were about

23:31to win and your party was about to win, but then Trump came along and

23:35said that he was going to turn Canada into the 51st state and everybody went

23:39crazy. Is that accurate? I wouldn't say they went crazy.

23:41I mean, it like, well, it was, they got very upset.

23:44They should be upset though.

23:45I mean, what's a crazy thing to say?

23:46It is a crazy thing to say.

23:48Canada is not for sale.

23:49We're never going to be the 51st state.

23:51Uh, you know, we love Americans as neighbors and friends, but we, we want to

23:55be uniquely and we want to be sovereign as Canadians.

23:59It's our country. It's where we grow up.

24:01You're a patriot as an American.

24:02I'm a patriot as a Canadian.

24:04It's where my grandfather arrived.

24:06It's where our collective ancestors put on military uniforms and sailed to fight wars.

24:12It's where our grandkids are going to live.

24:13We're very proudly Canadian. So we're never going to be the 51st state.

24:17And I just wish you'd knock that shit off so that we can get back

24:21to talking about the things that, that we can do as two separate, but, but

24:25two separate countries that are actually friends.

24:28Did that really have that much of an effect up there?

24:30Like did people take him seriously?

24:34I think at first everyone thought it was a joke because we've always had these

24:38jokes like, you know, one day we're going to take over Vermont and Detroit should

24:42be part of Canada and all that stuff.

24:44But then he kept saying it and saying it.

24:46And, uh, you know, it became, it became, uh, a lot of people got upset

24:52about it. And I think.

24:53Understandably so. Understandably. Yeah. I mean, it's a crazy thing to say.

24:57It is a crazy thing to say.

24:59I talked to him on the phone about it.

25:00It was like so funny.

25:01It's like at first I was joking, but then people were like, it's a good

25:04idea. That's not a good idea.

25:07He's saying that I can assure him of that.

25:09But and the tariffs aren't a good idea either.

25:13We should get the tariffs out because there's so much that we could be doing

25:16together as neighbors and partners if we got rid of those tariffs.

25:21You know, the I think what are the biggest problems in America today?

25:25Affordability, security. And we can help with both.

25:28We knock the tariffs down.

25:29Let's look at affordability. We have the fourth biggest supply of oil anywhere on Earth.

25:34You guys pay a huge price discount for our oil.

25:37Because we're effectively all our infrastructure to ship it is north south.

25:41And it's a very unique, heavy oil.

25:43So we accept, unfortunately, and for now, a price discount on the oil we send

25:50you, which can translate into more jobs and paychecks, but also lower energy prices.

25:54You've got $5 a gallon right now in lots of places in America.

25:58You're buying, I want to produce more so we can sell 2 million more barrels

26:02of Canadian oil into the US market.

26:04And then there's housing. You've got huge housing pressures on young people.

26:10They can't afford a place to live.

26:11We're the biggest supplier of lumber for home building of any country that imports to

26:17the United States, exports to the United States.

26:19We've got very low cost, but high quality softwood lumber we could be shipping.

26:23Or the best truck, the best selling truck in America for 45 years now is

26:30the Ford series. It's aluminum.

26:32It's a military grade aluminum body.

26:36You guys can't make enough aluminum here.

26:38You don't have enough bauxite or electricity to convert it into aluminum.

26:42You get your aluminum from us.

26:44A tariff does not bring the production to America.

26:46It raises the price of the aluminum and therefore the F series truck.

26:50Get rid of that tariff.

26:52You lower taxes, you lower the cost of an F series truck for the, for

26:56the miner in Appalachia or the electrician in Ohio.

27:00And, and that's just on the affordability side.

27:03There's a lot we can do with our minerals to make the continent a hell

27:06of a lot safer as well.

27:08So I think it's in America's interest to come towards a tariff free deal and,

27:13and trade freely as friends.

27:15And that will be good for both of us.

27:17Have you had conversations with Trump about this?

27:20No, I, I, I believe in the rule of one prime minister at a time.

27:24So I fought like hell to win.

27:25I didn't win. We came very close.

27:28So I, I've said, listen, I'll leave it to the prime minister to do the

27:31negotiating. And I've said, I'll support him any way I can.

27:34Even in my visit down here, I'm sending him a text messages to tell him

27:37what's going on, to try and support his work.

27:40Cause what we want, we both want what's best for Canada.

27:44Where are your elections now?

27:45When do you have the next elections?

27:48That's, um, this is a, a strangely hard question to answer because we're a weird

27:53system. Yeah, it's weird in comparison to ours.

27:56Yours are fixed. Um, as you know, ours, we have technically fixed election dates, but

28:00they, but the government can fall at any time.

28:02It's very simple. A rule is that if the opposition parties bind up and they

28:06can vote down the government, that is to say the majority of MPs in the

28:09house say we've lost confidence in the government.

28:11The election is now. Or if the prime minister, uh, decides he wants an election,

28:16he can call it. And the election is now, but, uh, he, it has to

28:20be sometime in the next roughly three years.

28:23Oh, so you have a deadline where it has to take place.

28:26Yeah, that's right. So. But it could happen tomorrow.

28:30The, uh, it wouldn't necessarily be tomorrow, but like, you know, in the next few

28:34weeks, if there were a non -confidence vote and the government lost it, then, then

28:39they, then they go to an election.

28:40So it's kind of like the British system.

28:42Interesting. Yeah. Oh, it is the British system.

28:44Really. We, we, we adopted the British system almost identically.

28:47So when you're campaigning, you're essentially, this is like a long game.

28:53Yeah. You're, you're just laying out your strategy, laying out what you would do to

28:57make Canada a better place.

28:59Yeah. Well, we have two roles.

29:01So I said, I'm the leader of the opposition, but I'm also prime minister in

29:04waiting. So the notion is that the Canadian people should not only have a government,

29:09but they should have an alternative.

29:10And that alternative has two functions, official opposition.

29:14It's actually called that. I think it's a proper noun of capital O, official capital

29:18O opposition, and also government in waiting.

29:22So you have to be prosecuting the government, but you have to present to yourself,

29:26yourself to people in a way where they say, yeah, that guy or that team

29:29could actually be the government.

29:31Those are the dual roles that I have to carry out.

29:34Interesting. And how long have you been attempting to become prime minister for?

29:40How long has this been going on for?

29:42Almost exactly four years because I launched my campaign in February of 2022.

29:48Was this something that you had always had in the back of your mind or?

29:52I'd say in the back of my mind, but it wasn't something I was set

29:55on. Like I thought maybe, you know, in my 50s or 60s, I would try

30:01it. But I was in no rush to do that.

30:04How old are you now?

30:05I'm now 46. And so what motivated you to do it?

30:10Well, you know, after COVID, as COVID was unfolding, it wasn't just the COVID policies

30:18themselves. It was the economic policies, because I've been very focused on economics in my

30:23parliamentary career. And I was seeing the size and cost of government, not just in

30:28Canada, but all around the world growing so much and that inflation was just destroying

30:33the working class people and that it was going to get a lot worse.

30:38And so I ran on the platform of making Canada the freest country on earth.

30:43We had a tradition of freedom in Canada.

30:47One of our earliest prime ministers, Wilfrid Laurier, we asked, what's Canada's nationality?

30:52And he couldn't actually list an ethnicity or a religion because we were already mixed

30:57up even 100 years ago.

30:58We had Scots and Irish and First Peoples.

31:01So he said, look, yeah, French, most of all French and English and First Nations.

31:06So he said, uh, Canada is free and freedom is its nationality.

31:11And I wanted to reinstate that idea.

31:13I wanted it to be the freest country anywhere on earth.

31:16And so I ran on that platform and won the leadership and then ran in

31:21the last election and stayed on after that election.

31:23That's kind of the last four years of my journey.

31:27And so the way your elections work now, so you're essentially just stating your case

31:33and going around and talking about what policies you would implement and how you would

31:37do things differently and just waiting to see how it all plays out.

31:42It's, we have, see, our prime minister is different than the president.

31:48He's actually part of the legislative branch.

31:50So he comes in to the House of Commons and we debate multiple times a

31:55week, he and I. So it's not just, you know, in your system, the Republican

31:59and Democrat hold like four debates right before the election.

32:03In our system, we're always debating.

32:04So he comes in, he's on one side.

32:06I come in, I'm on the other side and I ask him like six consecutive

32:09questions and then he answers and we go back and forth and that's called question

32:14period. Then we have these committees where we prosecute and propose on finance, natural resources,

32:20healthcare, you name it. So we're constantly prosecuting the government, also proposing better ideas at

32:25the same time. So like the other day, I proposed to bring back the auto

32:29pack between Canada and the U .S.

32:30to have tariff -free trade going both ways across the border.

32:34So that's an example of how I'm in a position to actually offer solutions even

32:37though I'm not in the government and then hopefully government actually steals my ideas and

32:41I've been encouraging them to steal my ideas.

32:44So what... Is this coffee, by the way?

32:46Yes. I need some caffeine.

32:47Yeah, I need some caffeine there.

32:50I'm a terrible caffeine addict.

32:53Me too. Cheers. Cheers. Oh, and shout out to George St.

32:59Pierre for hooking this up.

33:00Yes, George is a good man.

33:01He's the best. Great guy.

33:03He said he's going to have me do some pad work with him at some

33:06point. Oh, really? So that's pretty dangerous.

33:07Oh, that's awesome. He's here all the time.

33:09He's a fantastic guy. He's the best.

33:12He's one of the best representatives of martial arts you could ever hope to meet.

33:17He's got humility. I remember when he came to Parliament Hill years ago and I

33:21thought, geez, he's going to be...

33:23I thought he'd be cocky and a swagger, but he was so down to earth.

33:26Oh, he's so humble. So much humility.

33:28For what he's accomplished in MMA, I've introduced him to people and they have no

33:33idea who he is. Yeah.

33:34And then I go, that is one of the greatest fighters that ever walked the

33:38face of the earth. Absolutely.

33:39And they're like, no way.

33:40He's so nice. And that's the Canadian way, though.

33:43Like, it's soft -spoken and gentle and kind, but don't piss us off.

33:50Yeah, but tough. Yeah, he's really tough.

33:51That's where Trump fucked up.

33:53I wonder what would have happened if he didn't go along with that 51st state

33:57nonsense. I don't know. I mean, that is the narrative in this country, like I

34:01said, that if he didn't do that, that you would have won.

34:04Well, you never know. But I try not to cry over spilled milk.

34:07I focus on what I have to do and live in the present.

34:12But this new guy, Malott.

34:16Have you followed him, Mike Malott?

34:17Oh, sure. I know him.

34:18Yeah. He's going to be fighting in Winnipeg.

34:20I think he's the next GSP.

34:21He's very good. You like him?

34:23Yeah, he's excellent. Yeah. He did a great job in Montreal, if you saw him

34:27there. But you have, I've been to many of his, called a bunch of his

34:30fights. Is that right? Yeah, he's excellent.

34:32Yeah, he's, my buddy is his trainer, Crew Allen, in Hamilton.

34:39He's a Hamilton steel, steel town guy.

34:42And we're hoping that he has a big win in Winnipeg.

34:46Well, you guys have one of the best gyms in the world, TriStar, in Montreal.

34:50Is that right? Farah Sahabi.

34:51Okay. There's, like, maybe a handful of great masterminds in MMA, as far as coaches.

34:59Right. And Farah's at the top of the list.

35:01Is that right? And what's his discipline?

35:02He trained GSP. Is his discipline karate or kickboxing, Muay Thai?

35:06Well, I mean, he's, I mean, he's a true mixed martial artist.

35:10Black belt in jiu -jitsu, kickboxing.

35:12I mean, he can do everything.

35:14And he has a, TriStar is a place where a lot of people from America

35:18go up there for their camps.

35:19Interesting. Yeah. I'll have to drop in and see those guys.

35:22Oh, it's phenomenal. I mean, like I said, GSP trained up there.

35:25A lot of fighters trained up there.

35:27And he also had a great working relationship with a lot of people in America.

35:30So he would come down and, you know, they would exchange fighters back and forth

35:35and train with each other.

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37:30Yeah, well, we have a great martial arts tradition in Canada.

37:33I don't know if you know Mike Miles.

37:34He brought Muay Thai from Thailand to Calgary, like, back in the 70s or 80s.

37:42And he still got a great gym there.

37:44Do you know who Jean -Yves Theriot is?

37:46Yes, he's a buddy of mine.

37:47Oh, really? From Ottawa, yeah.

37:48Oh, no kidding. Yeah, he was a hero of mine when I was a kid.

37:51Yeah, he's incredible. When I was kickboxing, he was like my idol.

37:55Really? Yeah. Does he know that?

37:58I never talked to him.

37:59Well, he's going to see this.

38:00I bought his book. Yeah?

38:01I bought his book. I started running stairs because of his book.

38:04Right. Because he was talking about how it increased his leg muscles and his kicking

38:07power. I remember that. It was in one of his documentaries or something.

38:10He said his kicks weren't strong enough, so he would do stairs.

38:12But I went and trained at his dojo a few times.

38:15It's in South Ottawa. He was incredible.

38:17Yeah. He was one of the truly elite kickboxers of his time.

38:22He was a great boxer.

38:24I know he never competed as a boxer, but his hands were fantastic.

38:29Well, that's really what separated him from a lot of other people.

38:31It was like his accuracy and his technique was pristine.

38:34He told me that he would spend hours studying the distances that your limbs would

38:41have to travel depending on how you moved.

38:44He was kind of like a scientist in the way he learned and studied.

38:48And he was all about simplicity and removing anything unnecessary.

38:53I think Bruce Lee said that.

38:55He said, simplicity, hack away at the unnecessary.

38:58And, you know, how do you, what's the shortest distance to hit the strike?

39:03And, um, he's got a great, he's a really good heart too.

39:05You know, he had, um, he has a jujitsu club as well.

39:10And when I went in there, there was a blind fellow who was into jujitsu,

39:14which you can do as a blind person.

39:15Cause it's so much about feel, but with COVID he couldn't do jujitsu anymore.

39:19Cause they, they, they disallowed that kind of up close contact.

39:22So he actually found a way to train this guy with focus mitts, even though

39:26he was blind. It was really incredible.

39:28Oh, wow. Yeah. It was just, but it was incredible amount of patience he had

39:31invested in making sure this, this young man could keep doing his physical activity throughout

39:36COVID. Wait a minute. So they allowed pad work, but they didn't allow jujitsu.

39:40I don't know if it was a government policy or if it was just a,

39:42it was a policy at the gym because you're, you know, you're just so wrapped

39:46up and sweating. The gyms in America, everybody just, just kept going, kept going.

39:51They hid, they would like put foil over the windows and like hide or coming

39:55through the back door. A lot of the gyms in LA, that's what they did.

39:58They just plowed ahead. They just figured out a way to not get in trouble.

40:03And some people did get caught and get in trouble and nothing ever came of

40:07it because it's pretty unconstitutional to tell people that they can't work out together.

40:12Like the government really didn't have the right to tell people that they couldn't do

40:17what they wanted to do.

40:18That was a legal thing that you can do.

40:20Like all of a sudden there's this mandate.

40:24There's this law or rule being passed down, or at least it's being promoted that

40:29you're not allowed to go to a gym and work out with other people.

40:33Like, but those are the healthiest people.

40:36Those are the people that are the least likely to get sick.

40:39Like this, this is crazy to say.

40:41And you know, if you're sick and if you just have a good gym with

40:44good people, say, Hey, don't show up if you're sick.

40:47Everybody should be okay. These are the people you should worry about the least.

40:51We need to have common sense again.

40:53And too many governments in the Western world have gotten way too bossy.

40:56They're just looking for every excuse to boss people around.

41:00And, uh, that's what we have to push back again.

41:02And it's, you know, EV mandates or, um, you know, excessive, uh, control of the

41:08internet or, um, the massive increase in the cost of government, which is really like

41:14appropriating the private voluntary economy into the coercive government economy.

41:19Uh, that's, uh, that's what we're seeing across Europe and the UK parts of the

41:23United States, as well as, uh, back home.

41:26So we need to, we need to reverse that trend and get people back in

41:30charge of their lives. Well, the narrative has always been that rights lost are never

41:35regained or are very, very difficult to regain them.

41:39So how could you reverse that?

41:41Well, you have to keep fighting.

41:43I mean, we did regain, uh, our rights, uh, after COVID and, you know, the,

41:49the people have to look, look at the history of it.

41:51How did, which rights did you regain?

41:54Well, the, all the mandates are gone now.

41:56Of course, but those were ridiculous anyway.

41:58Yeah, they were ridiculous, but, uh, and they also impeded business.

42:02They, they ruined people's lives, social lives, but freedom has always had to be taken.

42:08Like you go, our tradition goes back to 1215 with the Magna Carta, the great

42:13charter. And most of the freedoms we have today were in that original document, right

42:17to a jury trial, uh, no arrest without charge, no conf, conf, confiscation without compensation,

42:23no taxation without representation, all comes from that one document, the Magna Carta.

42:28And, uh, it was because King John was taken aside by the barons and they

42:32said, listen, pal, this is the choice.

42:34Either you sign this and follow it, or we overthrow you.

42:38And as a result, we got the Magna Carta and all of, when you guys

42:41had your Boston tea party and said, you can't tax our tea because we don't

42:46elect you. That was a, an appeal as English, you were Englishmen saying, I'm not,

42:50we're Englishmen. We have the right not to be taxed unless we vote for it.

42:53And we're going to throw you out otherwise.

42:55But that came out of the fields of Runnymede in England in 1215.

43:00So it's a long march towards freedom and it's never actually done.

43:03Like there's no permanent victories or defeats.

43:06You just have to keep going forward.

43:08So if you were elected, let's say you get in right now, what's one of

43:13the first things you would do?

43:15I would unblock our resources.

43:17So we have the most resources of any country in the world per capita, bar

43:22none. We need to have, to make it happen though, we need to have the

43:25fastest permits anywhere in the world and the lowest taxes on producing those resources.

43:31We're the fourth in oil, the number, number one in uranium, number one in potash

43:36for fertilizer. We have the fifth biggest supplier of natural gas.

43:40We have, um, the longest oceanic coastline.

43:43Like we are, we have 12 of NATO's, um, sorry, we have 10 of 12

43:49of NATO's defined defense minerals.

43:52So, you know, you had that guy, a Palmer Luckey on, I don't think he

43:56can make his stuff without Canadian minerals and maybe I'm wrong.

43:59Maybe he'll correct me, but like night vision technology, you need to have, uh, you

44:04need to have germanium for that.

44:05You need to have a gallium to make, uh, semiconductors and radar.

44:10You need to have aluminum for armored vehicles and, uh, airplanes.

44:15You need cobalt for heat resistant alloys and fighter jets.

44:18You need tungsten for, uh, body, sorry, um, uh, armor piercing ammunition.

44:24We have it all. And what I want to do is unblock those resources, produce

44:29them in abundance for ourselves and our allies, make, you know, $200 ,000 paychecks for

44:34our trades workers, build up an enormous strategic stockpile of it so that we have

44:39tons of leverage in international relations.

44:42And if God forbid there is ever a global conflict, we would have all the

44:45resources necessary to win it.

44:47So, uh, but we need to, we need to pass, we need to get rid

44:50of a lot of laws that are blocking and, and replace them with laws that

44:54have fast permitting so that we can produce this stuff, uh, on scale very quickly.

44:59So is the concern, the environmental impact of extracting these things, is that what's holding

45:06it up? That is the, that's the ostensible reason, but I just think across Western,

45:14the Western world, like Europe, UK, parts of the U S and Canada, there's a

45:20problem with bureaucracy just growing way too damn big.

45:25Like, you know, the first nations in our country are incredibly forward looking.

45:30The Squamish built 6 ,000 units of housing on 10 acres of land.

45:34You can believe it in a town, in a city of Vancouver, where it's very

45:37hard to get a permit to do anything because it was their land.

45:40So they did it. They're trying to build, they're building now an LNG liquefaction plant

45:45where they replaced, uh, an old 30 mills.

45:48They cleaned it up and put an LNG plant there, but the federal government took

45:52a lot of time, 14 years to give them a permit.

45:55So we need to think like they're thinking, which is entrepreneurial speed of business, get

46:01it done quickly. Um, that's how you develop.

46:04Like we have this community in my, my district, it's called Hardesty, 600 people.

46:08They manage a hundred billion dollars of oil in a town of 600 people.

46:13Why is it there because their municipality offers a permit in one week with one

46:18page. And I wanted to tell this story.

46:21So I called them and I said, can I have someone come and do a

46:23video with me? And they said, we don't have anyone here.

46:25We don't have like bureaucrats that can help you.

46:27Like they're all out on their farms right now.

46:29They come in and they stamp the permit and they go back to their farm.

46:32Well, that's why we have a hundred billion dollars of energy moving through the area,

46:35which is bigger than the GDP of many countries because they have fast permits.

46:39And that's what we need in Canada.

46:40We need to be the fastest place to get things done.

46:42But don't you think you need some safeguards to protect the environment?

46:46And how do you balance that out?

46:49Protect it quickly. We can figure out what, what, whether a project is damaging to

46:53the environment in weeks and months rather than decades.

46:57Like there's nothing you're going to learn in year 14 of the review that you

47:00couldn't have learned in, in month 14.

47:02So there's ways to protect the environment when the Germans, so when the Germans had

47:07to break their dependence on Russia after it invaded Ukraine, they approved.

47:12And, and LNG import terminal in 60 days, they completed the whole damn thing in

47:17less than 200 days. And guess what?

47:20No environmental problems. They, they got their engineers to sit down and figure out how

47:23to do it quickly. And that's the, that's the mentality that we need to get

47:27in Canada. So what would you be able to do to bypass all this bureaucracy?

47:33How could that be done legally?

47:36Well, you slim it down to one project, one environmental review instead of 20 or

47:4030, you have a fixed timeline that the bureaucrats have to give an answer of

47:45six months rather than just as long as they want to drag it on for.

47:49Um, and the other thing I would do is study areas where they're, they're perfectly

47:53situated to have a project like a pipeline or a mine or an LNG export

47:57terminal or a port expansion.

47:58And I would pre -permit it.

48:00I would say to our officials, go in and study, make sure that the environmental

48:03aspects are all in good order.

48:05I'll issue a pre -permit and then anybody who comes along and wants to build

48:08it, as long as they follow the terms and act responsibly has a guaranteed permit

48:12before they even apply for it.

48:13Uh, and, uh, that, I think we would have a roaring economy if we did

48:17that. That sounds awesome. But the, the great fear is that if you do have

48:23an impact on the environment, that impact is often permanent and that it's devastating.

48:28And I've seen some of the oil extraction that they've done up in Alberta, where

48:33you look at the area, it looks like, like scorched earth.

48:37No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

48:39It's the most responsible oil extraction in the world.

48:41But when you, when you see these, what is that one area that often gets

48:46criticized? Fort Mac. Is that what it is?

48:48Yeah. It's, they're open pit mines.

48:50You open up a mine, you take out the, you take out the bitumen, um,

48:54you subtract, you, you separate the sand from the oil, you, you make it less

48:59viscous by putting diluent in it and you ship it off.

49:02And then after the oil is, after the mining is done, they, they resurface it

49:05and you wouldn't even know there was a mine there.

49:08And there's no impact to groundwater, no impact to the environment.

49:12I mean, there's an impact no matter what you do, but at the end of

49:15the day, the people who live there are very healthy and very happy and they're

49:18the strongest supporters of the expansion of the oil sands.

49:21It's an incredible - Because economically, it's amazing.

49:23Oh, it's incredible. It's the best resource in the world.

49:26It's like, uh, there's no decline rate.

49:28You guys have shale here, but you know, as the years go by, you get

49:31less and less out of a shale, uh, reservoir.

49:34We, we have very little decline, we can keep producing and producing, uh, we have,

49:39um, what's called the in situ where there's an entire oil sands operation under your

49:44feet. You could be out in a forest hunting and you wouldn't even know that

49:46under your feet, they're extracting it through a whole system of pipes where they inject

49:50just steam, steam. paper that loosens up the oil it sinks down it goes into

49:54another pipe comes up to the top and you can have beautiful pristine nature the

49:59bears the the the deer the birds they don't even know that there's extraction happening

50:03under their feet so we have the best industry the most responsible industry anywhere in

50:08the world it's been a really disgusting pr campaign by extremist environmentalists and frankly some

50:15of our competitors to try and make our industry look bad but it's the best

50:18industry in the world yeah they got me yeah i saw some videos on it

50:22i was like oh my god what are they doing to the ground what are

50:25they doing to the earth it looks horrible they're all it's it's all bullshit we

50:28have the it looks horrible like yeah but i mean it that's just a superficial

50:32look at it you i'll take you for a tour in the oil sense you'll

50:35be amazed we have the best engineers in the world and by the way the

50:38first nations people absolutely love it because it's lifting their people out of poverty they're

50:43getting enormous job opportunities out of it one of our mps is a former chief

50:48uh that where they took uh 18 percent unemployment brought it down to three balanced

50:52their budget another one of my members of parliament in northern british colombia negotiated a

50:5740 billion dollar lng plant on his on the heisla territory it's completely eliminating poverty

51:03for the first nations there and by exporting clean canadian natural gas which we can

51:08liquefy 25 percent cheaper because it's cold as hell in canada um they actually displace

51:15dirty coal overseas so instead of asia burning coal they're burning clean canadian gas that's

51:20delivered by first nations partnership so this is the best way to do it makes

51:24everybody richer and makes our entire continent better off what seems so simple the way

51:30you're laying it out i don't understand why this hasn't been implemented yeah this is

51:34this is the story of my life uh it's frustrating is it but it's if

51:38it is it that simple is it really that this is what's holding everything up

51:43the bureaucracy and the the time it takes for permits and yeah like a lot

51:47of things regulations we have the same thing in housing and and so do you

51:51like if you look at you look california california is terrible like why is there

51:55such a housing shortage in california it's because it takes forever to get a permit

51:59and there's always bureaucracy standing in the way and it totally screws over the working

52:03class youth who can't find a place to live because they're not being built and

52:07we have that challenge in canada as well that's why i proposed ideas to cut

52:11the bureaucracy and the taxes so that we can build affordable homes for our youth

52:15because right now we have a whole generation that can't afford homes and that was

52:20one of the biggest issues i ran on home ownership is necessary for family formation

52:24for civil peace in society where you know everybody feels like they have a piece

52:29of the pie we need to expand home ownership but to do that you've got

52:33to get the government gatekeepers out of the way speed up the permits free up

52:36the land cut the development taxes so let's assume that you got an office how

52:43much time would it take to start implementing these things and how quickly would that

52:48impact be felt by the canadian people look i think a lot of them can

52:53move very quickly there's a lot of projects that are people that that investors are

52:56sitting on but they don't have certainty and permits so i would unblock that and

53:01i think in the first year you would start to see immediate benefits for the

53:06working people who'd be getting these jobs um some of it would take more and

53:11more like a medium term like the second thing i would go after is just

53:16the inflationary spending which is a big problem all over the western world like people

53:23just can't afford to live i don't know if you you do do you encounter

53:27that around here oh yeah yeah i mean inflation is crazy and it's i mean

53:32the national debt in america just went up to 39 trillion right which is bigger

53:36than your gdp it's a lot of money so so explain this to me 50

53:41years ago a barber and a barber and a waitress could buy a house with

53:47a big yard for a dog and raise four kids meat and potatoes on the

53:50dinner table every night and now an accountant and a lawyer can't do that why

53:54is that well there's a lot of spending yeah and a lot of making money

53:59a lot of just cash turning you know just making dollar bills with nothing behind

54:07it nothing to back it this is the biggest fraud perpetrated on the working class

54:12people in the last hundred years printing money is just insane it's just the the

54:17idea you just print more money it's like and people go okay well it looks

54:21it looks painless at first but if you have an economy with 10 apples and

54:2510 dollars it's a buck an apple you double the number of dollars to 20

54:30but you still only have 10 apples well all of a sudden it's two bucks

54:34an apple it's not that the cost of apples has gone up it still costs

54:38the same resources to grow the and pick the apples is that the the price

54:41has gone up because the value of the money has gone down right so in

54:45america over the last 55 years you've doubled the number of homes in america from

54:51both 70 million to 150 million you know how much the money supply has grown

54:5530 times so you have twice the homes but 30 times the cash so what's

55:02happened housing costs have gone up 15 fold in 55 years and now an entire

55:08generation of kids can't afford homes we have exactly the same problem in canada this

55:12is the biggest wealth transfer from the working class to the the elites from i

55:18say the have -nots to the have yachts and washington and wall street love it

55:23by the way because it inflates the stock market inflates the bureaucracy politicians get to

55:28spend ceos get their stocks uh inflated um but it destroys the working people and

55:34we need to get back to to hard money everything should be getting cheaper by

55:38the way you know it takes 80 60 to 80 percent less resources to grow

55:42food we grow four times the food on the same acre get four times as

55:46much milk from the same cow we use 80 less water and fertilizer so why

55:51isn't it that food is not less expensive it's because all of those gains are

55:55being erased by monetary inflation so it's not that food is more costly it's that

56:01the value the money we use to buy it has less uh purchasing power and

56:05And we need to do what the Swiss do, which is they don't print money.

56:08They have balanced budgets, they have almost no deficit, and they have almost zero inflation

56:13in Switzerland. They have the strongest money in the world, the Swiss franc.

56:17And we would all be better if we operated like the Swiss when it comes

56:21to our money. So in a real -world scenario, it's like you take over Canada.

56:27How would you go about implementing this?

56:29You've got to cut bureaucracy, consultants, which consume, by the way, $26 billion of spending.

56:35How big is your debt in Canada?

56:37$1 .3 -ish trillion. Oh, that's baby debt.

56:40It's compared to you. You guys are really wild.

56:45But you've gotten away with it because the dollar, the American dollar, is the reserve

56:48currency. So all of these countries prop up the value of the U .S.

56:52dollar by keeping it on reserve.

56:55Better hope that doesn't change.

56:56Yeah, better hope. We don't have that luxury.

57:01But we do have a lot of debt, and we have provinces too.

57:05They're quite indebted. But I would cut the bureaucracy.

57:08I would cut consultants, foreign aid.

57:11I'd cut way back on foreign aid.

57:13We give corporate welfare these checks to corporations.

57:16I believe business should make money rather than take money.

57:19So I would get rid of that.

57:21We're giving a lot of money to fake refugees, people who come in and don't

57:28actually, or they're not actually fleeing danger.

57:31Like, I love real refugees.

57:33My wife was a refugee.

57:34But I have no time for people who are pretending, but they're not really.

57:37And what do you mean by pretending to be a refugee?

57:39How are they doing this?

57:40Well, they're not actually endangered in their home country.

57:42So they've come to be declared themselves as students and then wanting to stay declaring

57:49a refugee status. Oh. And this is common?

57:51Yeah. It's just a loophole?

57:53It happens. I mean, they just want to have a better life.

57:55So I don't begrudge them as people.

57:57But we can't spend money on social services, enhanced social services, advanced programs that we

58:04as Canadians don't get for people who are not paying into.

58:07So you're not opposed to them being there.

58:08You're opposed to them getting Canadian welfare.

58:11Well, I'm opposed to them.

58:12If they're not real refugees, they shouldn't be brought in as refugees.

58:16I think we have to distinguish between those people who are actually in danger in

58:20their home country, which is the definition of a refugee, and someone who just wants

58:24to come in excess of their proper immigration stream.

58:29Is this that common that it's actually affecting your economy?

58:33Right now, it's a challenge because we had a big number of international students and

58:37temporary foreign workers that came in in very large numbers in like two or three

58:41years. We were bringing in about a million people a year, which in America's terms

58:46would be 10 million, like just if you're doing per capita.

58:49And it really caused a housing shortage, like some places where you have 26 of

58:55these students living in one basement.

58:57So we're trying to unwind that now.

59:00And how do you do that?

59:02Well, when their work permit and their visitor visa runs out, then we have to

59:06encourage them to head back lawfully.

59:11Right. Right. But you don't want to do it ice style.

59:14No. No, I don't think we need to do that.

59:16I just think we have to be orderly and lawful about it.

59:19And is that supported by the Canadian people?

59:21Yes, because we're a very welcoming country.

59:23We're a nation of immigrants, but we're also a nation of laws.

59:26And there's a general consensus like across the spectrum in Canada that the population growth

59:35was too fast for like four or five years.

59:39And so we're trying to unwind that now.

59:43What are the other things that you would have to do to drop your debt

59:48and sort of balance your budget and begin to turn things around?

59:53Well, in addition, so I like this idea that actually, believe it or not, that

59:58Bill Clinton and the Republicans did in the 90s in the U .S.

1:00:02It was called the pay -go law.

1:00:04It was a very simple principle.

1:00:06Every time the administration wanted to bring in a new dollar of spending, they had

1:00:10to match it with a dollar of savings.

1:00:11So there was no extra net spending for like eight years.

1:00:16And that's when your government balanced its budget and paid off $400 billion of debt.

1:00:21That law lapsed in 2002.

1:00:24And immediately after that, America went back into deficits.

1:00:28And you haven't emerged. You've been in deficit now for 25 years.

1:00:32This is about internalizing scarcity.

1:00:34Every creature in the universe, every bird in the trees, every fish in the seas

1:00:38has to live with scarcity.

1:00:40Maximizing use of scarce resources.

1:00:42The only creature who doesn't do that is the politician because he's always using someone

1:00:47else's money. It's like, oh, I'll just print it or borrow it or tax it.

1:00:51It's not my money. And so they routinely show up to their cabinet meetings and

1:00:56say, well, I've got a new idea.

1:00:57It's $100 million. Where are you going to get it?

1:00:58I don't know. We'll print it.

1:01:00We'll borrow it. We'll tax it.

1:01:02Not my money. But if you had a law saying you can't actually bring a

1:01:05proposal to cabinet unless you have matching savings to pay for it, well, then you'd

1:01:08have these politicians walking up and down the hallways in their departments looking for waste

1:01:12and, like, rooting it out.

1:01:14So instead of making the single mom, the senior, or the small business owner live

1:01:19with scarcity, I want the politicians and bureaucrats to live with scarcity.

1:01:22And that's what I would impose by law on my government.

1:01:25Well, it's just a rational way to deal with the problem.

1:01:29Like, don't spend money unless you could save money.

1:01:33Exactly. That's how you balance things out.

1:01:35I mean, Clinton did balance the budget.

1:01:37He did. During his time.

1:01:38And people forget that. Because we've always assumed that there's always been this extraordinary debt.

1:01:42But that's not the case.

1:01:43During the 1990s, I mean, he did a fantastic job at that.

1:01:48Yeah. I mean, it was that Congress was very disciplined as well.

1:01:51And the American people just got fed up and said, we're not tolerating these deficits

1:01:55anymore. And they imposed scarcity from the center.

1:01:58And by the way, the economy boomed because the government was restrained and the free

1:02:02market economy could just roar.

1:02:04And that's another part of the equation, by the way, is unlock the power of

1:02:10free enterprise. Like, this is the 250th anniversary, not just of the Declaration of Independence,

1:02:16but also of Adam Smith's Wealth of Nations, where he basically for the.

1:02:20First time in human history described the free market system and that was starting to

1:02:26flourish in the states and in parts of Europe and that system basically started to

1:02:32come into place after you know the late 1770s the growth since the free market

1:02:37system has came and come into place in the world has been 200 times faster

1:02:42than it was before because there is the most powerful system for generating material benefit

1:02:48for the people and that's what we need to restoring Canada I want to make

1:02:51it the freest economy in the world well that all sounds amazing how the hell

1:02:56did you lose how can a rational person not vote for that I mean you're

1:03:06not saying anything that's restrictive you're not saying anything that is in any way infringing

1:03:11on people's rights or liberties or it just sounds like it's all just a hundred

1:03:16percent positive for Canada that's what I think that's that's my mission and I think

1:03:21it will be positive and we'll get there you know Canadians do things through evolution

1:03:25not revolution so I'm just going to keep pushing my ideas and I think that

1:03:29I think overwhelmingly we'll we'll win the next election well it sounds like I just

1:03:35can't see how someone would listen to what you're saying and say I find fault

1:03:39in this other than like the the potential environmental impact of extracting resources I could

1:03:45see how a lot of the greenies would get like really upset and get their

1:03:49panties in a bunch about that and and be very incredulous to the idea that

1:03:53you're going to protect the environment while you're extracting all these resources but if you

1:03:57could lay it all out and also lay out this enormous economic impact and how

1:04:02it would uplift impoverished communities how it would completely change the economic landscape of the

1:04:08country it just only makes sense that's why I'm baffled well listen the people render

1:04:16their judgment but I it means I have to do a better job of uh

1:04:19what were the criticisms of you like what did your opponent say that like people

1:04:25that resonated with people um what were they trying to say it was funny because

1:04:28accurate they all disagreed with my ideas and they said these are all very scary

1:04:32ideas scary and then they said growth first of all they said they said that

1:04:36I had no policies then they said uh they're scary policies and then they stole

1:04:40my policies right before the election so uh but hey listen if the government that's

1:04:45in power now steals all my ideas and does the things I want to do

1:04:48then I then I've won right that's why I came here I didn't just do

1:04:51it so that I could have the my name on the door so I keep

1:04:55saying to the prime minister steal my ideas right but he doesn't want to well

1:04:59he uh I won't criticize him on foreign soil but we'll uh but uh good

1:05:05for you yeah I mean uh we have a mutual that's what's a Canadian thing

1:05:09to do that is a great thing to do so polite you know that's what

1:05:13I'm saying about Canadians they're so polite it's funny your security guy was talking about

1:05:17the Canadian standoff of uh you know when you get to a door you go

1:05:20first no you go first you go first you can stay there all day actually

1:05:23looked this up the other day Ontario actually has an apology act it's a law

1:05:28that defines the apology because we always say sorry in Canada so they wanted to

1:05:32clarify that sorry is not a legal admission of guilt so like if we get

1:05:36into a car accident I say oh sorry man I it's terrible your bumper it

1:05:39doesn't mean that I'm guilty so it's actually in law there's so many apologies even

1:05:44if somebody else screwed up you say sorry that's funny that's so Canadian but you

1:05:50know the the great thing about Canada is we've always sorted our shit out peacefully

1:05:54like the the the Protestants and Catholics tore each other's eyeballs out in Europe for

1:05:59like hundreds of years and then we came to Canada and just got along and

1:06:03and that's the great thing about Canada is like you can come you know Muslims

1:06:06and Jews Christians uh and uh sorry Protestants and Catholics uh Hindus and Sikhs they

1:06:14come to Canada and they just get along they live on the same streets eventually

1:06:17we all start intermarrying and uh it's a it's a great thing about Canada but

1:06:21it really is a great melting pot you know yeah and and like folks get

1:06:25to keep their their cultures like uh at the same time as uh blending into

1:06:30the Canadian identity like my one my wife's from Venezuela and uh so like you

1:06:35know oftentimes I like I'm I'm in the house and there's like 16 Latinos and

1:06:39they're all speaking Spanish I have no idea what the hell's going on and uh

1:06:43they have this food it's called the jackas and I said they don't need to

1:06:47start start cooking this stuff I thought my wife I said to my wife did

1:06:49did your mom just call me a a jackass um because that's what it sounded

1:06:53like I don't speak any Spanish but you should probably learn I should now they're

1:06:58yapping in your house you should know what they're planning it's a great uh my

1:07:01kids are starting to learn Spanish so I'm going to be outnumbered yeah you better

1:07:04learn it yeah yeah but um so what else is uh an issue in Canada

1:07:12that you would like to fix um we toss me those napkins we have to

1:07:17we got a I got an allergy I'm dealing with we we got to toughen

1:07:20up our justice system um we it got way too soft and uh what's wrong

1:07:26with your justice system basically bail um I mean we all believe in the basic

1:07:31principle that you're innocent till proven guilty but if someone's convicted has have like 150

1:07:36prior convictions and they're newly arrested on their latest crime yeah I don't think we

1:07:41should be released releasing them onto the streets and uh so we got two lacks

1:07:45on bail so there's now a consensus in Canada that you should have severe restrictions

1:07:51on repeat offenders like in Vancouver they had to arrest the same 40 guys 6

1:07:56,000 times in one year 40 guys 6 ,000 arrests so they're basically being released

1:08:02within hours of their latest arrest so we're we now brought built a bipartisan multi

1:08:08-partisan consensus to fix that and we're pushing to toughen the bail system um and

1:08:15ensure that it's the repeat offenders the tiny group we don't have a lot of

1:08:19criminals in Canada but they do a tremendous amount of crime so if you take

1:08:23them off the street you put them in prison you can basically reduce the crime

1:08:26rate dramatically well we probably have more crime percentage -wise in America but it's still

1:08:32a small percentage of the population that commits the crime But it's the same issue.

1:08:36Like in New York City, it's extraordinary, the amount of people that are repeat offenders.

1:08:41And they just let them go.

1:08:43And California, no cash bail, let them go.

1:08:45It's like, it is bananas, and it doesn't make any sense, and it doesn't make

1:08:49anybody help. I understand you want to be empathetic, and I understand these narratives that

1:08:54the prison system is racist, and the justice system is racist, and these people have

1:08:59never been given a great shake in life.

1:09:01Well, if you want to fix that, start in these impoverished neighborhoods, establish community centers,

1:09:07establish better education, fund that.

1:09:10But don't let hardened criminals back on the street when they're habitual.

1:09:16If you've been arrested 40, 50 times, it doesn't seem like you're getting any better.

1:09:21So whatever rehabilitation process they have going on there, that's not working.

1:09:26So keep doing the same thing over and over again.

1:09:28And unless you like crime, I don't understand why you would do that.

1:09:32This has been, you know, it's imposed by these so -called experts.

1:09:35They tell, oh, we've done all these studies that show that these often crime policies

1:09:39work. But everywhere it's been tried, it's been an absolute disaster anywhere in the Western

1:09:44world. We have a town called Penticton.

1:09:47There's one guy who the police can tell by looking at the crime rate whether

1:09:52he's been in jail or not.

1:09:53When he comes out of jail, the crime rate for the entire town of Penticton

1:09:58actually goes up. That's so crazy.

1:10:00But you just keep him in prison.

1:10:01That seems so simple to solve.

1:10:04It's like there's so many of these problems with government that it's just like rational

1:10:08thinking. Exactly. One of the great interviews that I loved about you, you were eating

1:10:12an apple. And you were talking to this guy who was being completely ridiculous.

1:10:16You were asking him to define the issues that he had.

1:10:19And it was so funny.

1:10:20It was like this is what happens when a rational person meets a person with

1:10:23empty narratives. It was such a weird moment because...

1:10:27You just kept eating that apple.

1:10:28It was such a good apple.

1:10:30It was so good. That's the thing.

1:10:32And the thing is I didn't even realize I was being taped.

1:10:35I thought it was a print interview.

1:10:36Oh, that's hilarious. That's why I think I was so relaxed.

1:10:42So I'm in the most beautiful place in the world.

1:10:43If you haven't been to the Okanagan, it's unbelievable.

1:10:46Like it's lakes, it's mountains, it's nice dry weather, and there's orchards and vineyards there.

1:10:53Like you'd love it. And so I'm in an apple orchard, and I'm walking around

1:10:57just talking with people. And my staff says this reporter wants to do an interview,

1:11:00and I'm enjoying the apple.

1:11:01He comes up and starts asking questions.

1:11:03Nobody who was there thought this was a moment.

1:11:06Like we thought nothing of it.

1:11:07We dumped the whole thing.

1:11:08My staff, unbeknownst to me, was recording my whole walk.

1:11:11We dumped this 15 -minute video on the internet, and no one noticed it.

1:11:14And like three weeks later, my phone blows up, and people say, Hey, how about

1:11:18that apple? I'm like, what are they talking about?

1:11:20This apple thing. And then, you know, within three days, everybody's talking to me about

1:11:24this damn apple that I had almost forgotten about eating.

1:11:27So it was weird things.

1:11:29Well, that conversation sort of embodied this issue.

1:11:34It really did, because you have rational thinking and empty narratives colliding while you're eating

1:11:41an apple. Like you're so casual about it, you're actually eating an apple, which was

1:11:45so perfect. I mean, you couldn't, if you planned on, like if you had a

1:11:49PR team, I think you should be eating an apple.

1:11:52They'd be like, ooh, I like it.

1:11:53So he's casual. He's eating fruit.

1:11:56It's healthy. It was totally coincidence.

1:11:59Like out of nowhere, not planned, and not even noticed.

1:12:02Like I said, no one there thought this was going to be a moment.

1:12:05We just like totally forgot about it.

1:12:07Well, it made it in America.

1:12:08It was viral in America.

1:12:10And we were like, how come that guy's not the prime minister?

1:12:12What the hell's going on?

1:12:13Well, in the meantime, you can buy Ambrosio apples from the South Okanagan.

1:12:17I'm really plugging a lot of sales for the Canadian economy today.

1:12:21You know what I found out about Canadian maple syrup?

1:12:25What's that? It is actually a superfood, and it is actually better for you than

1:12:29honey. Is that right? Yeah, it contains a bunch of polyphenols and a bunch of

1:12:34like healthy nutrients. I always thought maple syrup was just a guilty pleasure.

1:12:39You pour it on pancakes.

1:12:40No, it's a totally Canadian thing.

1:12:41Apparently, it's really good for you.

1:12:42So you take it before your workout?

1:12:44No, no. I just watched an Instagram video yesterday.

1:12:47Somebody sent it to me, and I was like, what is this?

1:12:49We'll have to send you a bunch of maple syrup from Canada.

1:12:52Oh, I've got a bunch.

1:12:52I've had a bunch of Canadian friends send me some.

1:12:53We actually have a maple syrup reserve in Canada, like a reserve of excess stockpiles.

1:12:59Like oil reserve? Well, we don't have an oil reserve.

1:13:01This is something I want to change.

1:13:03I want to have an oil reserve, but I also want to keep the maple

1:13:05syrup reserve, because we're Canadians after all.

1:13:08There's nothing more Canadian than that.

1:13:09Well, it's so delicious. I can't believe it's good for you.

1:13:12Make sure that's true. I mean, in what way is it true?

1:13:17Are there nutrients? Let's put it into perplexity, our sponsor.

1:13:20I compared it versus honey.

1:13:22I'll give you what it showed.

1:13:23That's not saying it's better.

1:13:25Maple syrup and honey are both sugary, but maple syrup is slightly lower in calories.

1:13:29The glycemic index has more minerals like manganese and calcium, while honey is a bit

1:13:36higher in calories, has a slightly stronger impact on blood sugar.

1:13:40Well, this guy on Instagram was very convincing.

1:13:44I wish I saved it.

1:13:45I think it's convincing. I think you should go with it.

1:13:47I'm in it. I'm done.

1:13:49Stick with it. Tastes better, too.

1:13:51Yeah, it's the best. It's fantastic.

1:13:53Put that with a little bit of Greek yogurt, your protein.

1:13:55Oh, yeah. There you go.

1:13:56That's what I do. Greek yogurt.

1:13:58And maple syrup. Absolutely. Maybe we'll start a trend, because everybody uses honey on their

1:14:02yogurt. No, maple syrup from Canada.

1:14:04All right. Because if it's not from Canada, it's not the real deal.

1:14:06Well, there's a lot of fake syrup, right?

1:14:08A lot of fake maple syrup.

1:14:08There's a lot of junk out there.

1:14:09Yeah. When you go to a pancake house, and they have that stuff in the

1:14:12little plastic cups, that's garbage.

1:14:14Corn syrup crap. Yeah. You don't want to have that manufactured crap.

1:14:17Well, that's the case with honey as well.

1:14:19I had a woman in here once that was a beekeeper, and she was explaining

1:14:21to us that a lot of honey is not actually honey.

1:14:25They water it down with corn syrup.

1:14:27There's so much shit in our food these days.

1:14:30Yes. I believe in eating clean.

1:14:32A hundred percent. Well, I mean, that was one of the primary factors for me

1:14:37supporting this administration was RFK Jr.

1:14:40and this Make America Healthy Again initiative.

1:14:43Because I think, you know, I had my friend Brigham Bueller yesterday from Ways to

1:14:47Well on, and, you know, we...

1:14:49I hammered this many times over and over again, but people need to hear it.

1:14:53We spend more money on health care and we're sicker than we've ever been before.

1:14:58And we have more chronic illness and we have more money.

1:15:01None of it makes any sense.

1:15:02It's completely ridiculous. And it's obvious that people are eating the wrong things.

1:15:07And there was so much outrage of him implementing all these healthy choices and trying

1:15:11to get rid of dyes that are illegal in Canada.

1:15:13Like the same cereals that the same factory sells in Canada, they sell with natural

1:15:21dyes. And in America, we demand them to be more colorful.

1:15:25So we put poison in them.

1:15:26Really? Yeah. What do you think are the dietary habits that are making people in

1:15:35the Western world sick right now?

1:15:37Like, is it the dyes?

1:15:38Is it the sugars? Is it the carbs?

1:15:41There's a lot of things.

1:15:41What's getting people? There's a lot of things.

1:15:43First of all, it's processed foods.

1:15:45Processed foods is an enormous percentage of a lot of Americans' diets.

1:15:51Things with massive amounts of preservatives in them.

1:15:53And that's, like if you want like a general guideline, eat real food.

1:15:59Eat real eggs, real vegetables, real meat, real fish.

1:16:03You'll be healthier. Yeah. As soon as you start having things that can sit on

1:16:06a shelf forever, except things like rice and, you know, normal beans, like things that

1:16:11are dried that make sense that could sit there.

1:16:13But if something can just sit on a shelf for a long period of time

1:16:17and you consume it, how is it just not rotting?

1:16:19Exactly. I'm sure you've seen where they've taken a McDonald's Big Mac and they've just

1:16:23let it sit, taken a cheeseburger in a box and the guy pulls it out

1:16:27like 10 years later. It looks exactly the same.

1:16:29That's not food. The bacteria didn't want to eat it.

1:16:32They looked at it and they were like, I'm not eating that.

1:16:34If bacteria doesn't eat it, if mold doesn't eat it, that's crazy.

1:16:37Why are you eating it?

1:16:38Like there's something in it preventing the mold from growing.

1:16:42Exactly. What is that? Well, that stuff fucks with your gut bacteria.

1:16:46It's terrible for your body.

1:16:48And empty calories. And we consume an enormous amount of processed food in this country.

1:16:53And if you want to be a healthier person, eat real fruit, eat real food,

1:16:59eat real vegetables, eat real meat.

1:17:00It's that simple. Yeah. That would fix 90 % of our problems when it comes

1:17:06to people's diets. And we, when my wife once looked at some of the baby

1:17:12formula we had and she said, she looked on it, she said, there's no expiry

1:17:15date on this. This never goes bad.

1:17:17That's crazy. That can't be a good thing.

1:17:19Right. Meanwhile, breast milk, you have to freeze, right?

1:17:22Exactly. Yeah. So, uh, and then what about on the, like the fitness side, what

1:17:27do you think we can do?

1:17:28I mean, beyond you, you've done a lot just talking about it and with your,

1:17:31the size of your audience, you've probably got a lot of people off the couch,

1:17:35but what policies do you think we could push that would get people physically active

1:17:40working out moving again? Well, the real important thing is community.

1:17:44The easiest way to get fit is to, to get around a bunch of other

1:17:48people that are also involved in the same endeavor, right?

1:17:51If you have a bunch of friends that are unhappy with the way their life

1:17:54is like, just go walk together.

1:17:56Say, Hey guys, let's all go for a walk after dinner together.

1:18:00Right. Let's all decide like as a neighborhood to go walk, just walk for a

1:18:04half an hour after your meals.

1:18:06It'll lower your glycemic index.

1:18:07It'll change your body. It'll make you healthier.

1:18:11You'll feel better. Right. You know, it just does so much for you, just movement

1:18:16and activity. And if you're involved with a group of people that are also inclined

1:18:21in the same direction, they're also trying to get better, trying to get fit, then

1:18:26you kind of, you're, you know, you feed off of your atmosphere.

1:18:29Right. People imitate the people that are around them and you get support from the

1:18:33people that are around them, you know, make it a little healthy competition, you know,

1:18:37who can, you know, do the most exercise and who can do the most, you

1:18:41know, what, whatever it is, like whether it's a sport or whether it's a game

1:18:45or whether it's just something that you enjoy doing.

1:18:48That's physically, physically taxing slightly.

1:18:52Right. It doesn't have to be a crazy kettlebell workout or a jujitsu class.

1:18:56Just take a, just take a walk.

1:18:58Just to, just to, if the world, if the United States or Canada or anybody

1:19:02that's got problems with their health, just decided to start walking.

1:19:07Right. Every day for 20 minutes.

1:19:09It'll change your life. Absolutely.

1:19:10And then add things to it.

1:19:11Add some body weight squats, add some pushups, skip a little rope.

1:19:15Right. Do something. Take a yoga class.

1:19:17It'll change your life. Right.

1:19:19Absolutely. You need activity. The human body has needs.

1:19:23And when it doesn't, those needs are not met and you don't, your biological requirements

1:19:28aren't met, you get develop anxiety, you get overweight, your, your muscles atrophy, your bone

1:19:34density decreases. You can't open up a jar anymore.

1:19:37There's all these problems that could be solved with just simple movement and activity.

1:19:42You don't have to become a fitness nut.

1:19:44You have to become a gym rat.

1:19:45You just do something and that alone and then change what you eat.

1:19:50Drink more water. Stop drinking soda.

1:19:53Stop, stop drinking so much alcohol.

1:19:56You know, stop eating processed food.

1:19:58If we just slowly but surely get this in people's heads.

1:20:02For the longest time, people didn't think there was anything wrong with eating processed food.

1:20:07They didn't think there was anything wrong with, they thought sugar just gave you extra

1:20:11calories. That's it. They didn't realize the catastrophic health consequences of consuming all this sugar.

1:20:16The increase in type 2 diabetes, all these problems that people are having, that people

1:20:20are having because of poor diets and a lack of movement.

1:20:23So what's your theory though on how that, why did that happen?

1:20:26Why did, what caused millions of people to shift their diets away from good, wholesome,

1:20:33real food towards the processed garbage?

1:20:35Well, first of all, marketing, right?

1:20:39And availability, right? The, the, the, they always say the center of the grocery store

1:20:44is what you should avoid because the center is all the stuff that doesn't need

1:20:47to be refrigerated, right? Everything on the outskirts, all the vegetables and the fruit and

1:20:51the meats and the milk, that's all the stuff that's healthy because it has to

1:20:54be refrigerated. Right. Because if it's not, it goes bad.

1:20:56Things that can just sit on a shelf, but things that sit on a shelf

1:20:59forever, those are the things that are the easiest to profit from because you don't

1:21:03have to worry You have to worry about storage, you have to worry about refrigeration

1:21:05when you're processing or when you're moving them and transporting them.

1:21:09You know, just education is the most important thing because there's a lot of people

1:21:14that don't know how much their diet impacts them.

1:21:17And then there's also the problems that happen in this country where the sugar industry

1:21:21literally bribed scientists to pass the blame on saturated fat and pretend that this was

1:21:27the cause of all these heart issues that people were having and all the obesity,

1:21:31that it was just fat.

1:21:32So then people started eating all these seed oil rich foods like mayonnaise or excuse

1:21:37me, like margarine and, you know, corn oil and canola oil, all this.

1:21:43When it's better just to have tallow or butter.

1:21:45Yes. It's like natural food.

1:21:47Your body knows what to do with it.

1:21:49Beef is like a superfood.

1:21:50A nice fatty piece of beef, best thing you can eat.

1:21:54It's so good for you.

1:21:55You've got iron, you've got fat, you've got protein and creatine.

1:21:59It's all packed in that one superfood.

1:22:01It is. And people, there's a lot of people that live very healthily off a

1:22:05carnivore diet and that astounds people.

1:22:07They don't understand it because they've been pushed into this idea.

1:22:11Well, one of the things they did in America that's great is they reversed the

1:22:13food pyramid. Our food pyramid was all grains at the bottom, was all wheat and

1:22:17grains, which is like, there's nothing wrong with eating that as long as you're being

1:22:22smart about it. You don't eat too much of it.

1:22:24But if that's your primary diet, like, guess what?

1:22:27Your insulin is going to spike.

1:22:28You're going to be hungry all the time.

1:22:30You're going to get fat.

1:22:31This is not good. It's not good to eat that way.

1:22:33When I cut the carbs out and I went basically into ketosis, I felt great

1:22:38because instead of having all the ups and downs when my blood sugar was down,

1:22:43when you're in ketosis, you basically live off your fat stores.

1:22:48You have like a consistent flow of energy whenever you need it.

1:22:51Cause I've obviously, I've got some here and, and so I feel lighter.

1:22:57I have to sleep less now.

1:22:58I don't have to sleep as much cause I don't, I don't eat the big

1:23:00heavy carbs. I cheat once in a while, but, but the big heavy carbs that

1:23:04your body breaks down, you gotta, you gotta sleep more to work through all those

1:23:07heavy carbs. So you feel it when you eat them.

1:23:10I love carbs. Don't get me wrong.

1:23:12Like I love, I'm Italian.

1:23:13I love spaghetti. I love pizza.

1:23:16I love Italian subs. I love them, but I eat them sparingly.

1:23:19And when I eat them, I feel it.

1:23:21I feel it. Like it's amazing why you're eating it.

1:23:23And then you're like, oh, you got hit with a tranquilizer dart.

1:23:27It's just not good. It's not good for you.

1:23:29If I eat a steak, I feel great.

1:23:30If I eat a steak, I don't feel, I don't feel in any way tired

1:23:36after I'm done. I don't feel exhausted, like completely full.

1:23:40Also, they have a high satiety rate.

1:23:42Like if you eat just steak, you're only going to eat what you need.

1:23:46Like this, your body knows when to stop.

1:23:49But if there's mashed potatoes next to the steak and spaghetti next to the steak

1:23:52and bread and all these other things, you're just going to keep eating.

1:23:55Exactly. And then cake and butter and ice, or not butter, but like cake and

1:23:59ice cream and all this other stuff, you're going to keep eating and you're going

1:24:02to consume excess calories. But beef is really expensive now.

1:24:05Like it's really hard to put a steak on your plate.

1:24:08These for the average guy, it's insane.

1:24:11It's twice as expensive as a pork in Canada right now.

1:24:13Well, there's also this dumb narrative that cows are responsible for climate change, which is

1:24:18just absolutely insane. And whoever started promoting that needs to go to jail because it's,

1:24:24you've done a terrible disservice to people, especially regenerative farming that's, you know, actually sequesters

1:24:30carbon. Absolutely. And it's healthy for you.

1:24:33No, the farming, the ranchers in my area are fantastic.

1:24:37They produce an incredible product.

1:24:39We've got this, the North America has the smallest cattle herd since 1951 this year.

1:24:44That's nuts. Very small herd.

1:24:45And that's why it's so hard to get beef.

1:24:47Why is that? I think there's been a demand spike in the last couple of

1:24:52years. Beef prices were low for long.

1:24:55So a lot of ranchers got out of it.

1:24:57I just said, we can't, I can't stay in this business losing money every year.

1:25:00And then all of a sudden prices started to go up and moods have changed

1:25:06a lot on beef, even in the last three, four years.

1:25:08So now they're trying to keep up with the demand, but I'm like, I'm happy

1:25:13to see the ranchers doing well, but I'd sure like to see middle -class families

1:25:18to be able to afford to have beef again.

1:25:21And, um, but you know, my theory on one of the reasons why the marketing

1:25:24has shifted towards all this processed crap.

1:25:27And this goes back to my obsession, which is inflation, because what, instead of just

1:25:32raising the prices, they downgrade the quality of the food.

1:25:36They strip out the nutrients and they inject garbage into our food.

1:25:41Uh, the, the, the companies do that is ultimately less nutritious, but it, the price

1:25:47tag doesn't necessarily look like it's changing.

1:25:49So it's one of the more insidious ways that the system is able to charge

1:25:54you to, to, to pass inflationary costs on without you seeing it in that, the

1:25:59price tag that that's underneath the product.

1:26:01They also engineer food to be compulsive.

1:26:04Like you're more compulsively. Is that right?

1:26:06Yeah, sure. Especially like chips and stuff like that in America.

1:26:09What country do you think does nutrition the best around the world?

1:26:13Well, that's a good question.

1:26:14Um, well, Japan has one of the lowest obesity rates, right?

1:26:18And when you look at Japanese food, like, what is it?

1:26:22It's like fish and rice and vegetables and it's, it's, they don't use glyphosate.

1:26:27I don't think, I think, I think the way they process their wheat is very

1:26:31different than ours. You know, we have, uh, higher glycemia.

1:26:35We, we have higher gluten in our wheat because of like, we have more complex

1:26:40glutens in our wheat. So we have higher yield.

1:26:42And then on top of that, they dry all the wheat out with glyphosate at

1:26:46the end, which is fucking terrible for you.

1:26:48And they were trying to ban that in America, but then Trump passed an executive

1:26:54order, uh, stopping it. So this is one of the things that Kennedy kind of

1:26:58ran on is that he wanted to stop the ubiquitous use of glyphosate and especially

1:27:04glyphosate, you know, used with wheat to dry it out.

1:27:09So it's not used, uh, as an herbicide.

1:27:12It's used to dry out the wheat at the end so that it doesn't get

1:27:16moldy, which is crazy. But you're.

1:27:18spraying poison on wheat and most Americans if you test them have glyphosate in their

1:27:25blood you know and the apologist will say oh but it's at safe levels well

1:27:29we don't even really know what that means you were talking about decades and decades

1:27:33of consuming this stuff that can't be good I mean it literally kills plants it

1:27:39destroys gut bacteria it can't be good it would would be better when you eat

1:27:44overseas like if I eat pasta or bread in in Italy it you feel better

1:27:48it doesn't kill you like it does in America it doesn't like oh you don't

1:27:52get that same feeling interesting I didn't know I don't want to think about glyphosate

1:27:56but um one of the things do you guys use glyphosate in Canada I don't

1:28:01want to think about it I feel bad saying that but I should do my

1:28:04homework on that one well we have corn that's engineered to survive glyphosate we have

1:28:08roundup ready corn so so that you could spray glyphosate on the corn that kills

1:28:14all the other things that you don't want growing okay but how is that how

1:28:18can that be good like most America like they they did a test of uh

1:28:23California wines and what was the number it was like some preposterous number of California

1:28:31wines tested positive for glyphosate like in the high 90s I think okay which is

1:28:36just nuts yeah I don't know anything about glyphosate I have to admit well I

1:28:40research you've piqued my curiosity the problem is in America our food system is entirely

1:28:48dependent on it at this point you know they want to change it and so

1:28:51there's a lot of strategies one of them is they're they they have these machines

1:28:55that use lasers and these lasers go over a field and actually target the weeds

1:29:01so instead of spraying poison on them they just zap these weeds and they can

1:29:05identify the difference between the weed and the crop really yeah that's incredible yeah the

1:29:10wine was 10 out of 10 tested but 10 out of 10 I was looking

1:29:13at the Japanese obesity thing they have an interesting law that they put in place

1:29:17in 2008 where I believe it says workplaces have to measure people's waists of adults

1:29:24over 40 to find out if they're potentially overweight wow those people don't get fined

1:29:29the companies get fined so they have to then provide them counseling diet advice exercise

1:29:34guidance wow and they also use a lower BMI than we do there there's it

1:29:39starts at 25 it says it's because they have a higher risk in Asian populations

1:29:44for uh obesity interesting I wonder why that is I wonder if that's because a

1:29:52lot of rice consumption way lower four per six four point four to six percent

1:29:56compared to a forty two percent wow that's crazy their obesity rates are four to

1:30:02six percent and we're 42 42 is nuts 42 is so crazy find out what

1:30:09the Japanese are doing my next stop has got to be Tokyo yeah well they

1:30:13eat healthy food you know and that but that doesn't make sense I mean implementing

1:30:17something like that it sounds very restrictive you know I mean I don't want to

1:30:21tell a guy he can't have a gut like I have a lot of friends

1:30:24that are fat and I love them to death I'd like them to be healthy

1:30:27but I wouldn't you know I don't believe you should have that kind of control

1:30:33over people no I think you should encourage healthy behavior I don't think you should

1:30:37mandate it yeah we need we need carrots not sticks yeah carrots literally literally but

1:30:43the the system is like um you know I think of the opioid thing that's

1:30:48an incredible story really that's a horrible story um that's a horrible story and you

1:30:52know the fact that no one's going to jail for that is infuriating they should

1:30:56what they did and what the the deception that they use to pretend that that

1:31:02stuff is not addictive that it's not the same as heroin is just absolutely atrocious

1:31:08and the fact that they got away with it and that the Sackler family just

1:31:11that one family I don't know if you've ever seen the Netflix docudrama series yeah

1:31:16painkill or was it was it called painkiller they're the guys from Purdue right Purdue

1:31:22pharma yes I think they were Purdue pharma if I'm not mistaken I mean how

1:31:26many lives were destroyed by that well a half a million ended in the U

1:31:32.S. yeah at least 50 ,000 in Canada we lost we lost more people in

1:31:37the last 10 years to opioid overdoses than we lost fighting in the second world

1:31:42war and uh that's so crazy and we you know these companies I mean it

1:31:47started in the states with Purdue and uh a number of others where they basically

1:31:52started lying to the system and paying they actually paid bonuses to distributors for every

1:31:59overdose they caused they tracked the overdoses and then paid bonuses to distributors because that

1:32:06was an indicator of how successfully they were pushing the drugs on to doctors and

1:32:11pharmacists and the system no way it all came out in the in the court

1:32:15uh because there was a huge lawsuit and they the companies had to pay 50

1:32:19billion dollars because of an American government lawsuit against them but they actually paid bonuses

1:32:24for overdose rates that's true it's wild and they basically they were very very strategic

1:32:32they said we're going to go to working class neighborhoods where there's huge unemployment so

1:32:38you know in the rust belt of America where people were out of work and

1:32:42they obviously had some minor industrial injuries and said you know this will solve every

1:32:47ache and pain take oxycontin and it felt great when they first started taking it

1:32:51and then it spread into Canada as well and then it mutated in from oxycontin

1:32:56into fentanyl which is a hundred times more powerful than heroin it can stop your

1:33:02your lungs in 15 seconds just absolutely deadly and uh we you know these companies

1:33:08these dirt bag companies should be paying hundreds of billions of dollars to cover the

1:33:14treatment and recovery of the people whose lives have been ruined by this well it's

1:33:18just insane that they only had to pay a percentage of the amount of money

1:33:23that they profited it is insane they should have gone to jail they should have

1:33:28they should have had to pay first of all give all the money back yeah

1:33:31i mean what you did was unbelievably evil absolutely and you were allowed to profit

1:33:37from it which is crazy for years even the sackler family the amount that they

1:33:41got fined was a small percentage of what they actually made i don't know how

1:33:46people live with themselves when they do that they're sociopaths they have to be they

1:33:49basically got into the entire system the health care system the medical acumen community and

1:33:55they pushed these over prescriptions um and then they got this crazy idea that they

1:34:00pushed in places like portland and seattle and san francisco that the government should start

1:34:05giving out opioids that are safer than the ones that are on the street as

1:34:09an alternative to keep people from having contaminated drugs which made the problem even worse

1:34:14because those the the addicts would sell those to kids so that they could buy

1:34:19the harder stuff off the street and it expanded it even more and um so

1:34:24one of the things we're focused on my plan is is massive treatment to recovery

1:34:28programs to get people off drugs abstinence -based treatment is incredible it gets very successful

1:34:34and uh we're saving lives now in canada you get them in you get them

1:34:38counseling group therapy treatment uh sweat lodges for first nations uh people's um physical exercise

1:34:45is a big part of it i went to one treatment center in saskatchewan and

1:34:49they actually bought these rusted out weights and they had the guys like lifting weights

1:34:53and the bureaucrats are saying well why are you spending money on weights what does

1:34:56that have to do with it he says well it's been the best thing we

1:34:58had these guys started to see their biceps grow and they're like i want to

1:35:02look like this and if i take drugs i'm not going to look like this

1:35:04so it was one of the best things they did um then you get them

1:35:07into jobs and treatment and uh there's one guy that uh i met in bc

1:35:12he he was going to kill himself he drove his car into a brick wall

1:35:16because he was so ruined by his addiction but he didn't die he couldn't even

1:35:20pull it off so he actually went into treatment turned his life around started a

1:35:25business he's got six employees and now he's going out on the street and like

1:35:29helping you know pulling guys off the street and bringing them in and saving their

1:35:32lives so it's actually a really hopeful ending to the story if we can get

1:35:36to shift all our resources over to treatment and recovery services which is one of

1:35:40my big objectives are you aware of ibogaine no so former republican governor of texas

1:35:47rick perry is involved in this ibogaine initiative here in texas and one of the

1:35:52things that they found you know he works very closely with veterans and uh you

1:35:56know obviously a lot of these guys they come back from the war they have

1:36:00ptsd they have a lot of pain they get addicted to pills and then they

1:36:06have an incredibly difficult time getting off of it and there's a treatment called ibogaine

1:36:12and ibogaine comes from the ibogaine it's uh like a natural psychedelic that has no

1:36:19recreational use whatsoever it's not fun and it's it's apparently a brutal 24 -hour experience

1:36:26but it rewires the brain stops the pathways of addiction and just one ibogaine treatment

1:36:33one session the amount of people that never go back to using those drugs is

1:36:40in the 80 percent really when they do two sessions it's in the 90s wow

1:36:45it's incredible so they're implementing it here and rick perry who was like a staunch

1:36:50anti -drug hardline republican guy great guy but realized from talking to these veterans maybe

1:36:59you have to have an open mind and look at this we have this blanket

1:37:02term that we use for drugs and we say oh ibogaine's a drug you don't

1:37:07want to take drugs but this psychedelic this ibogaine apparently it it's like a 24

1:37:14-hour review of your life that in some way some chemical way rewires your system

1:37:22and stops the pathways of addiction it's like a factory reset yes wow yes that's

1:37:28crazy and so they're starting to implement here in texas and they're going to use

1:37:32it so i've like studied this have they done and they've done is it approved

1:37:35like as a treatment or well it's being approved here in texas and they're trying

1:37:39to do it in other places and i know a friend of mine my friend

1:37:42ed clay he started a center down in mexico and the reason why he did

1:37:47it was because he got hooked on pills he hurt his back he got hooked

1:37:49on pills he had to figure out how to get off of it and he

1:37:52did one ibogaine session got clean really and it was like i need to educate

1:37:57people and help people with this it's wild let me start this system and you

1:38:01know and it's very successful i know multiple people that have done it and especially

1:38:07veterans that have done it and had profound changes in their life because amazing yeah

1:38:12and again there's no recreational use for this there's no chance of abusing it okay

1:38:17it's not fun like to get people to do it twice it's very hard okay

1:38:21but even doing it once but if you do it it's incredibly effective much more

1:38:27effective than any other form of therapy really yes okay well i'll have to look

1:38:31out for that one because we need it we still have a challenge up in

1:38:33canada i can connect you with rick perry okay and he's he's him and brian

1:38:39hubbard are incredible with their the advocacy and the the promotion of this what they've

1:38:44done is really amazing yeah we got it we got to get uh get people

1:38:47off these drugs and uh you know we're we're doing we're making some good progress

1:38:52in canada um our biggest challenges are are just the long -term aftermath of the

1:38:57opioid uh problem like you have had down here but um but like i think

1:39:02uh i think we can overcome it and uh we have to try some new

1:39:06things in order to get people off these things because they're because it's when you're

1:39:09doing fentanyl it's it's russian roulette it could be you might not have more than

1:39:14a day to live if you're still taking that stuff so it's so dangerous and

1:39:17it's in everything it's in so many different um street versions of pills that people

1:39:24think are safe right like xanax there's like illegal xanax like street xanax and there's

1:39:29fentanyl in them people take it and they die right absolutely i've met so many

1:39:33mothers they just come up to me at my rallies and things and they tell

1:39:36me the story and they show me a picture and you say man it's a

1:39:38beautiful child that child looks healthy and smart and she went to a party and

1:39:43they were handing the shit out and there's a high school kid here in town

1:39:47that happened man He took a street Adderall, and it had fentanyl in it, and

1:39:50he died. Is that right?

1:39:51Yeah, somebody sold him what he thought was Adderall.

1:39:54Look, that's what killed Prince.

1:39:55That's what killed Tom Petty.

1:39:57Adderall? No, no, fentanyl. Fentanyl.

1:40:00They got street drugs from someone.

1:40:02Like, they're both in pain, and they become addicted to the pills.

1:40:06And then they got, like, a pill from a roadie.

1:40:08I didn't know that. And took it and died.

1:40:10I didn't know that. Petty, did he sing Last Dance with Mary Jane?

1:40:14Last Dance with Mary Jane, yeah.

1:40:15Right. That's really sad. Oh, he sung a bunch of amazing songs, American Girl.

1:40:19I mean, Tom Petty was a legend, and died because of fentanyl.

1:40:23Prince is one of the great musical geniuses of human history.

1:40:26And fentanyl got him, too.

1:40:28Died from fentanyl. Unbelievable. He had hip pain.

1:40:30He needed a hip replacement.

1:40:32His hip was blown out, and he was in agony all the time.

1:40:34So he started taking pills, and then next thing you know, you're hooked.

1:40:38And I've had family members that got hooked on it.

1:40:40Is that right? Yeah. Did they get through it?

1:40:43One of them didn't, yeah.

1:40:44I mean, he hurt his back doing construction and started taking pills, and now he's

1:40:49a waste. That's the sad thing.

1:40:51That's the sad thing is it's they're good people, and they're not law -breaking people.

1:40:56No. Often it's folks who work in physically demanding jobs.

1:40:59They get an injury. Exactly.

1:41:00And it's easy to judge, but when you're in excruciating pain, and you find something

1:41:06that makes it go away, it's understandable.

1:41:09Also, if you're not educated in these subjects, and you just trust the doctor, you

1:41:14go to a doctor, and the doctor says you need pain medication, and then all

1:41:18of a sudden you're on it.

1:41:20It's easy to see how people get locked into that, and then they can't break

1:41:24loose. Well, the pathway to physical addiction, it's so well -known and studied.

1:41:29It's very, very addictive, which is why it's so horrific that they actually promoted the

1:41:35fact that these things are not addictive when they were promoting them.

1:41:37No, they knew exactly what they were doing.

1:41:39They were absolute crooks, and I'm hoping we get big settlements out of them the

1:41:42way you did down here, and I want to put all that money into treatment

1:41:45and recovery, get people off these drugs, and rescue them.

1:41:49I think we can save these lives.

1:41:51Treatment, it works. It's tough.

1:41:53Like, the people who go through it, they say, it was the worst experience of

1:41:56my life to go through that withdrawal, but it can be done, and you come

1:42:00out stronger on the other side.

1:42:02It can be done, and I think the most important thing is prevention and education

1:42:06and letting kids know, like, hey, this is not what you want to get involved

1:42:10with. You want to have a happy, successful life.

1:42:13This is going to stop that.

1:42:14This is going to keep you from having it.

1:42:16This might kill you, and it's definitely going to ruin you.

1:42:19Yeah, but you're right about fitness, though, because when I was young, I hung around

1:42:23with a lot of people who got into a lot of trouble, and I could

1:42:25have ended up there. The reason I didn't, frankly, is sports.

1:42:28I had something else to drive me, so it's one of the reasons why we

1:42:31need to get our young people active in sporting activities when they're in that age

1:42:35group, because if you're not giving them an outlet, then they'll end up down that

1:42:39scary path. Oh, 100%. And also, you realize that if you want to be effective

1:42:43in sports, like, you can't party.

1:42:45Exactly. It's like, it'll rob you of your vitality.

1:42:48Exactly. It'll rob you of your performance.

1:42:50No, when I played hockey, and I showed up a few times hungover, and I

1:42:53was just shit. Yeah. Like, I was terrible.

1:42:55But you learn pretty quick that you've got to be on your game.

1:42:58So we've got to promote more of the fitness at the youth level as well.

1:43:03And is that happening here?

1:43:04It's funny. I remember when I came down here as a 16 -year -old.

1:43:08I haven't been here in 30 years.

1:43:12We got into town, and the people who were hosting us were driving us to

1:43:17their home, and we saw this stadium, and there was like 20 ,000 people.

1:43:20And it was in Houston.

1:43:22And I said, is that the Cowboys playing?

1:43:24And they said, no, no, that's a high school league.

1:43:26It's like, okay, in Canada, we don't have high school leagues with 20 ,000 people

1:43:31coming out. But the sports are so massive here.

1:43:35Oh, football is gigantic here.

1:43:37It's a religion. Yeah, it's incredible.

1:43:39It's crazy. Who do you cheer for, by the way?

1:43:42In Texas? Yeah. You personally?

1:43:45Well, I've got into UT football.

1:43:47Okay. I really love going to the UT games.

1:43:50It's so fun, and they're so enthusiastic.

1:43:55And they just love it.

1:43:57It's like, when you're a part of it, when the touchdowns get scored and everybody's

1:44:00cheering, it's so contagious. Right.

1:44:04It's really amazing. And it's just like the enthusiasm they have for it.

1:44:07It's like, wow, this is a great, these people love this here.

1:44:11Yeah. But I've been to high school football games, and it's the same thing.

1:44:14Like, packed stadiums for high school football games.

1:44:17And you're like, this is nuts, man.

1:44:18These people love their sports.

1:44:20We're like that for hockey in Canada.

1:44:21Oh, yeah. It's serious, serious.

1:44:23Like, parents are very fixated.

1:44:25And I think it's actually a good thing.

1:44:27Some people say, oh, it's terrible.

1:44:28I think it's great to have parents that are competitive because they're pushing their kids

1:44:31to be better and more excellent.

1:44:33And even if they don't end up as NHL hockey players, it gives them that

1:44:36competitive ed. And I want us to be a more competitive society.

1:44:41Well, when I was a kid, I worked at the Boston Athletic Club.

1:44:45And one of the people that I, I was a fitness instructor when I was

1:44:4919. And one of the people that I worked with was Bobby Orr.

1:44:52Oh, really? Yeah. Bobby Orr used to come there and train him.

1:44:55We used to have to help him get on the VersaClimber machine because his body

1:44:58was so wrecked. Really? He had so many surgeries.

1:45:01His knees were so destroyed.

1:45:04He had scars all up and down his knee.

1:45:07Because he had knee surgery back when they were just experimenting.

1:45:10You know, they didn't really know how to fix knees.

1:45:12They just cut you open, screwed things back together again, and then it would blow

1:45:16apart again. And then you'd wind up having another surgery.

1:45:19So he had many, many knee surgeries, and he could barely walk.

1:45:23But he was still doing some kind of physical activity?

1:45:26Oh, yeah. He was playing racquetball.

1:45:27How old was he at the time?

1:45:29Oh, this was 1986. So, I mean...

1:45:35Jeez, that's like, what, 40 years ago?

1:45:38Uh -huh. Yeah. So he was, you know, he was probably in his 50s, 40s

1:45:44or 50s. Now, he's a legend.

1:45:46But he could barely walk.

1:45:47I mean, his knees didn't straighten out.

1:45:49Really? They were always, like, slightly bent, and they only bent that much.

1:45:53His range of motion was very small.

1:45:55So you had to help him get on machines.

1:45:58But the nicest guy. Right.

1:46:00And a legend. Like, you couldn't believe you.

1:46:01He's really there. Right. He would walk into the gym and you're like, oh my

1:46:05God, that's really... As I was 19, I never met a famous person.

1:46:08And I was like, that's Bobby Orr.

1:46:10Absolutely. This is nuts. But it also made me realize, like, boy, knee surgery's no

1:46:15joke. Like, this guy was like an incredible athlete and now he can't even straighten

1:46:19his leg out. Yeah, it's all temporary.

1:46:21You got to take care of yourself.

1:46:23Yes. Do you have, like, residual injuries from fighting back in the day?

1:46:29Oh, yeah. Yeah, I've had three knee surgeries, two reconstructions, two ACL.

1:46:33Was that from Taekwondo? Yeah, and Jiu -Jitsu.

1:46:36One of my ACL injuries was from Jiu -Jitsu.

1:46:39And what injuries are the most common in Jiu -Jitsu?

1:46:43Knees, backs, necks, shoulders. Those are the big ones.

1:46:47Elbows. Is that because of the arm bars and all that stuff?

1:46:51Yeah, not tapping. That's a big one.

1:46:53A lot of guys get hurt just because of their ego, because they don't want

1:46:56to tap. And you don't strike me as the type of guy who taps very

1:46:59quickly. Well, when I was younger, I was really stupid and I wasn't into tapping.

1:47:03Right. But as I got older, I got a lot smarter.

1:47:09Fortunately, I got a lot better, so I wasn't, like, in a situation where I

1:47:12had to tap a lot.

1:47:12Right. But if I did, I did.

1:47:14I just tapped. And that's the smart thing to do.

1:47:16And I would tell people, treat it like you're playing basketball.

1:47:19Don't treat it like it's your life or death.

1:47:21Right. The game is life or death.

1:47:23The game is if a guy gets you in an arm bar, he's essentially breaking

1:47:26your arm. If he breaks your arm, he can kill you.

1:47:28Right. That's the game. But don't treat it like that.

1:47:32Treat it like you can tap and keep going.

1:47:35Right. Or you can not tap and your arm's going to be destroyed maybe for

1:47:38the rest of your life.

1:47:39Right. And I've seen that happen with people where their forearm snaps and they have

1:47:43to have plates in it.

1:47:44And then it's a chronic injury for the rest of their life.

1:47:47Right. Yeah. No, I can imagine that.

1:47:49And what about in Taekwondo?

1:47:51Like, you told the story once about how you really clocked a guy.

1:47:54I think it was a wheel kick or something.

1:47:55Yeah. And that, like, freaked you out.

1:47:57That changed my whole outlook on fighting because I realized that could happen to me.

1:48:02And I had knocked people out before, but I'd never knocked anybody out where they

1:48:06didn't get up. Like, usually they get up and they're wobbly and, you know, they

1:48:10get sat down and, you know, medics take care of them.

1:48:13And, you know, after a while they're walking around.

1:48:16And this guy never got up.

1:48:17And I never really got over that.

1:48:20I never had the same lust for hurting people because it was just, I was

1:48:26young, you know, I was 19.

1:48:27And when you're 19, you think you're invincible or you don't, you don't think about

1:48:32the consequence. I knew I could get hurt.

1:48:34I've been hurt before. I've been kicked really hard and punched really hard before.

1:48:37I knew I was vulnerable, but I didn't think there was going to be anything

1:48:42permanent. Did the guy ever get out of the hospital?

1:48:44I don't know. Really? I don't know what happened to him.

1:48:47I don't know what happened to him.

1:48:48Maybe he'll hear this show and give you a call and say that he's all

1:48:51right. Oh, no, no. He probably don't want to talk to me.

1:48:53Well, your spinning back kick is incredible.

1:48:56I saw you and GSP doing that video where you were showing him how to

1:49:00do the back kick. Yeah.

1:49:01Did he ever use that in a fight?

1:49:02Yeah, he did. Yeah, he did.

1:49:04He landed it? Yeah, he used it a lot.

1:49:05It's a thing that, like, you have to almost grow up doing it.

1:49:11Right. You know, unless you're dealing, like, John Jones developed it later in his career.

1:49:15I saw that. He's a wizard.

1:49:17But he kind of, like, started implementing it, like, sort of two -thirds through his

1:49:21career. Did you teach him how to do that?

1:49:22No, no, I did not.

1:49:23He worked with a Taekwondo coach in Albuquerque.

1:49:25Okay. And he just really worked on that one technique, specifically when he went up

1:49:30to heavyweight, because the guys would be, first of all, less agile and mobile, and

1:49:34also it was the kind of technique where you could stop a guy with one

1:49:37shot. Right. And when you're a guy who's smaller than most heavyweights, which John is,

1:49:41because he was a light heavyweight, so he was fighting at 205 most of his

1:49:45career, and just as a challenge decided to go up to heavyweight.

1:49:48But he's so intelligent, he realized, like, I need a one shot that I could

1:49:52put people away. So he spent hours and hours every week just going over the

1:49:58spinning back kick. Really? To the body or the head?

1:50:00Yeah, the body. The body.

1:50:01Yeah. It's like getting hit by a car.

1:50:03Right. There's so much power in that.

1:50:04You get hit with that.

1:50:05Like, a wheel kick to the head is really difficult to develop.

1:50:09That's, it's like a fast twitch thing that, it's almost like your body has to

1:50:13evolve and grow doing that to really develop the kind of speed that you could

1:50:19pull it off on a skilled opponent in a fight.

1:50:21And the accuracy. Yeah. Like, to try and time that all, that must be incredible.

1:50:25I mean, there's freak athletes that could pick it up later in life.

1:50:28There's some people that are just really good at everything.

1:50:30They just have amazing dexterity and coordination.

1:50:33But for most people, you, like, I learned it when I was a kid.

1:50:37So, like, my body matured doing those things.

1:50:41Right. My body matured kicking.

1:50:43And it became a part of, like, just my average, like, normal movement of life.

1:50:47Right. You know? That's amazing, yeah.

1:50:50And the spinning back kick, though, is it typically a body kick?

1:50:55Yes. Do you throw with that?

1:50:55Well, you throw, I've thrown it to the face, too.

1:50:57Especially a jump spinning back kick to the face.

1:50:59Wow. But the one. Wasn't it really the Koreans that developed so they could actually

1:51:04kick a man off a horse in war?

1:51:07Is that why the kicks are so high?

1:51:08I don't think so. Okay.

1:51:10I think it was just because they were, they're smaller in stature.

1:51:12And they realized that you had to have more powerful kicks.

1:51:15Okay. You know, like, because your legs are always carrying your body around.

1:51:19There's a lot more mass to your muscles and your legs, and there's a lot

1:51:22more force you can generate with your kicks.

1:51:23Did you ever see the fight between Rick Rufus and that Muay Thai guy?

1:51:29Oh, yeah. Wasn't that incredible?

1:51:30Yeah, that changed kickboxing. We've showed that fight a hundred times on this podcast.

1:51:36It's amazing because it was like Americans versus Thai and Rufus.

1:51:40We didn't really understand leg kicks.

1:51:42Right. Because PKA karate, and I found this out later because of Benny Urquides, who

1:51:47came in the podcast. He told me that the reason why they didn't allow leg

1:51:51kicks in PKA karate was because of Bill Wallace.

1:51:54So Bill Superfoot Wallace famously had one leg that he kicked with.

1:51:58It was because his other leg, he had a bad knee.

1:52:01Right. And he didn't want anybody kicking his legs.

1:52:03Interesting. So he promoted this idea that only have above the waist kicks.

1:52:07Right. And that's what we had in America.

1:52:10Like, that's what Jean -Yves Theria fought most of his career.

1:52:12That's right. He did. He fought Rufus himself, actually.

1:52:14Yes. Yeah. Yeah. No, that...

1:52:16that was incredible because if you looked at the the art form rufus was so

1:52:20much more beautiful to watch than the thai guy he came in he broke the

1:52:25guy's jaw in the first round i think hey he knocked him down a few

1:52:29times was it once or twice he knocked him down a couple times i believe

1:52:32but it was and the guy just kept chopping his leg and and then i

1:52:36think he went out in a stretcher because his leg was busted in like nine

1:52:39places he didn't know what to do he didn't understand it what was really interesting

1:52:43is his brother duke became a muay thai world champion after that fight was that

1:52:47the was that the the guy who was at the fight commenting after the fight

1:52:51yes yes i remember that he was saying it doesn't take any skill yes i

1:52:54remember that he was embarrassed by that later in his life because he became one

1:52:58of the top mma trainers really yeah and he took on muay thai yes well

1:53:02he became a muay thai world champion and he developed rufus sport which is a

1:53:06great gym in milwaukee a top gym developed world champions like anthony pettis so he

1:53:11was uh you know he was a pioneer it was one of the guys that

1:53:14had to figure it out and you know he spent time in thailand they all

1:53:17they all learned it they had to learn and because it was the best place

1:53:20in thailand to go is it phuket is it bangkok like well there's so many

1:53:24good places thailand's the real motherland of muay thai obviously and it's like you know

1:53:28um phuket's amazing uh bangkok's amazing i mean there's so many amazing gyms that are

1:53:36in uh in thailand they're tough there's whole strips in phuket my wife and i

1:53:41were there on vacation once and we just stumbled on this whole street and uh

1:53:45you could do there was sort of american style boxing there was there was a

1:53:49crossfit type thing then there was that tiger muay thai and a bunch of other

1:53:53muay thai facilities and then there's there's like street vendors that would were cooking meals

1:53:57specifically for people who are there training um like you could buy a beautiful you

1:54:03know hard -boiled eggs and and avocado and uh chicken strips and this is like

1:54:08high protein just catered to the people who come from around the world to train

1:54:12for like five six weeks in a in a clinic and there's people that do

1:54:15it just recreationally my friend mark he's a he's a businessman he's in his 60s

1:54:20and he did he went over to thailand did he survive yeah he trained he

1:54:24spars all i saw him the other day he had a black eye he's in

1:54:27his 60s i'm like what are you doing man so if you were starting from

1:54:30scratch you and you wanted to be a mma would you do like you go

1:54:34to uh thailand and do a do like a two months there and then go

1:54:38to dagestan to learn how to wrestle is that would that be the best combo

1:54:41if you were starting out if you're a kid i would say wrestling wrestling is

1:54:45number one yeah that's the most important thing to learn because if a guy can

1:54:49take you down he could do whatever he wants to if he could take you

1:54:51down and hold you down and beat you up if you don't know how to

1:54:54wrestle you can't fight right you need it at least to learn wrestling just to

1:54:58understand wrestling take down defense but you did jujitsu later in life didn't you yes

1:55:03right i didn't start jujitsu till i was 29 i think yeah and who do

1:55:09you like right now who do you think is the most interesting fighter to watch

1:55:12these days oh there's so many it's impossible to say the most interesting there's a

1:55:16guy uh from spain ilia tapuria yeah yeah i really like tapuria he's what david

1:55:23goggins calls uncommon amongst uncommon men once more coffee no no thank you i'm good

1:55:28thank you he's a freak i mean he's just incredibly talented like weird weirdly talented

1:55:35like his last three fights he knocked out three all -time greats holloway yeah holloway

1:55:41alexander um um uh and um uh charles olivera so right that's crazy volkanovsky who's

1:55:52like one of the greatest featherweights of all time knocked him out knocked out max

1:55:56holloway another one of the greatest featherweights of all time right and then charles olivera

1:56:00one of the greatest lightweights of all time he knocks out three guys in three

1:56:03fights and there's no one has a resume and he's not like as i understand

1:56:07he was a greco -roman guy right and he became a boxer later on he's

1:56:12just how do you describe how do you describe like so i'm not i'm not

1:56:18knowledgeable in this area but the way he he almost looks like he has a

1:56:21philly shell is that a philly shell what he does with a little bit of

1:56:25that well he has amazing defense he's just amazing awareness and he pattern recognition technique

1:56:33it's he's like he's a combination of all things right incredible confidence incredible intelligence insane

1:56:40discipline work ethic but just uh great training methods like he does everything right and

1:56:47then insane confidence like his confidence is insane he when he fought charles olivera for

1:56:53the lightweight title he celebrated his victory the night before he had a party to

1:56:58celebrate the night before the fight and then went out and knocked charles out in

1:57:02the first round and said he was going to knock charles out in the first

1:57:04round that's incredible one punch boom but you know what impresses me most about him

1:57:09is how he got up after that kick to the head he took i know

1:57:11that was incredible yeah and you know who else did that was gsp remember gsp

1:57:15took that carlos and he went down but he recovered quickly and he was talking

1:57:20to me about how because i said to him like in politics you get hit

1:57:24you get hit right and not not physically if you're lucky but but you have

1:57:28to be able to get up quickly and react to it i asked him how

1:57:31did you do it how did you like how does your brain go from taking

1:57:34that kind of hit to getting back in the fight and turning it around and

1:57:39he said he like it's two very deep breaths through the nose and then out

1:57:42through the mouth and get some oxygen back into your system and focus your mind

1:57:46i thought that was an incredible lesson well i mean it's all in how you

1:57:50get kicked because you could just get knocked out and then it's over it is

1:57:54nothing you could do if you get shut off you get shut off right certain

1:57:57people get shut off it just you just get kicked you can get kicked and

1:58:01it kind of glances off of you or you can get kicked and it just

1:58:04slams right in the side of your neck and the lights go dark right but

1:58:09if you're if you're still able to recover and and think quickly it's incredible to

1:58:15have that kind of pre -programming to ready you for a moment like that well

1:58:19i mean that's a big part of his what i was talking about the the

1:58:23camp that he comes from i mean for us the hobby is like one of

1:58:27the most intelligent and one of the most brilliant trainers in the sport hobby is

1:58:30like one of the most brilliant trainers in the sport who's who's who's who's who's

1:58:30who's who's who's who's who's who's who's who's who's who's who's who's who's who's who's

1:58:30who's who's who's who's who's who's who's who's who's who I don't know.

1:58:30This? Farras Ahabi. He's the guy from Montreal, from TriStar.

1:58:34So he's the guy who trains his...

1:58:35Yes. Trains GSP. Oh, GSP, okay.

1:58:38Yes, okay. And I mean, I think that is...

1:58:40That's a big part of why GSP was able to recover.

1:58:43Like, they prepare for everything.

1:58:45Right. You know, it's like, there's nothing left to chance.

1:58:48Like, he hires people to try to knock George out in training.

1:58:52That was one of the things he did.

1:58:53He would give them more money if they could knock him out.

1:58:56So they would just... So he would be, like, fully prepared when he was fighting.

1:59:00Like, they leave no stone uncovered.

1:59:02Don't you have to, like, budget, though, the number of headshots you take?

1:59:06Yeah, 100%. But he was pretty confident that George...

1:59:08I mean, it wasn't like he was doing this with a beginner.

1:59:10Right. He was doing this with a world champion, one of the greatest of all

1:59:13time. Okay. And he, you know, he wanted George to be in danger.

1:59:16You know, so George had to fight like he was going to fight inside the

1:59:20octagon. Right. In danger. Because John Jones said somewhere that he had...

1:59:25Like, every time he gets hit hard in camp, he said, like, I just...

1:59:29That's part of my brain budget that's been taken away.

1:59:33Well, that's why John's so smart.

1:59:35Yeah. He recognized that. There's a lot of people that don't think that way.

1:59:38John also famously won't take a fight on short notice.

1:59:41Is that right? He wants to be fully prepared for a fighter.

1:59:44Even a guy, like, when he fought Chael Sonnen, they offered him a Chael Sonnen

1:59:49fight on short notice and he said no.

1:59:50Like, there is not a time, no disrespect to Chael, he's a great fighter.

1:59:55No, there's not a time on this life, in this earth, where Chael Sonnen is

1:59:59going to beat John Jones.

2:00:00It's just not going to happen.

2:00:01He could have taken that fight on one day's notice and still beat Chael Sonnen.

2:00:04He's that much better than him.

2:00:06But he still wouldn't take it.

2:00:08He's like, no, I'm going to be fully 100 % prepared.

2:00:11That's smart, though. Yeah, also he hated Chael, and so he wanted to make sure

2:00:14that there was not a chance that Chael could do anything to him that he

2:00:17would have been able to, wouldn't have been able to do if he was trained.

2:00:20Do these guys hate each other?

2:00:22Sometimes. But most of them, do they respect, or is it, it depends on the

2:00:26fight? It really depends. Like, when Ilya Tepuria fought Charles Oliveira, he actually apologized to

2:00:33him before the fight. He said, I'm sorry, it has to be you.

2:00:35I really like you. Kind of crazy.

2:00:41He's got to be careful.

2:00:42But he's hated people, too.

2:00:43He's hated people he fought, too.

2:00:44I mean, there's some people that just rub you the wrong way.

2:00:46There's some people, there's strategies to get inside your head and fuck with you and

2:00:50for you to fight with emotion.

2:00:51Well, Habib with McGregor, he really hated McGregor.

2:00:56He almost didn't let go when the tap happened.

2:00:59Oh, yeah, yeah. That was something else.

2:01:01Is Conor ever going to come back, do you think?

2:01:04Only Conor knows. I mean, if he's going to, he has to do it soon.

2:01:08I mean, I think he's 30.

2:01:09How old is he now?

2:01:1037? He's jacked now, eh?

2:01:14Yeah. Well, not anymore. Oh, he came back down?

2:01:17He was on the Mexican supplements for a while.

2:01:19Okay. Because he was trying to recover from his leg break.

2:01:24Right. So when he fought Dustin Poirier.

2:01:26I remember that. He got on some stuff to try to recover for that.

2:01:29I don't know what he got on, but clearly it helped.

2:01:32He got huge. He got super jacked.

2:01:34The problem with getting super jacked like that is then you get addicted to what

2:01:37got you super jacked. Because if you're on steroids, you feel like Superman.

2:01:41You know, you feel like you could just run through walls.

2:01:44Right. And then you get off of it.

2:01:45And now your endocrine system has to kind of catch up to the fact that

2:01:49you've been giving it exogenous testosterone for all these months.

2:01:54And so that takes a long time for you to get back to a normal,

2:01:57healthy level. So you feel like shit.

2:01:59It's hard for these guys to get off of steroids.

2:02:01Right. I can imagine you get addicted to being that's right.

2:02:04I've never done it. I don't plan on it.

2:02:06How old is he? 37.

2:02:0837. Almost 38. That's getting up there.

2:02:11Yeah. Who's the oldest fighter that's ever been in the octagon?

2:02:13Like who's a serious competitor?

2:02:15Probably Randy Couture. I think Randy won the world title, the world heavyweight title in

2:02:21his 40s. Wow. Yeah. But Randy didn't even start his mixed martial arts career.

2:02:27I think I was there at his first fight in 1997, and I think he

2:02:34was 34 or 35 before he ever had an MMA fight.

2:02:40He was just an elite wrestler who made his way into MMA because there's no

2:02:46real professional outlet for actual amateur wrestling.

2:02:49Did you ever interact with the Gracies?

2:02:51Oh, sure. Because I remember way back in like I remember MMA or UFC 2.

2:02:55It was the second one.

2:02:56That was when it really kicked.

2:02:57Because the first one was a little bit strange.

2:02:58It was that big fat guy whose tooth went flying out.

2:03:00Yeah. But number two was the one with Shamrock and Gracie and Dan Severn.

2:03:08Was he in number two?

2:03:09Dan Severn, the wrestler? I think he was later.

2:03:11He might have been three or four.

2:03:12Yeah. But that was kind of the first generation of big names.

2:03:16Oh, Hoist Gracie changed the world.

2:03:18Yeah. He was a slow style though, man.

2:03:21Like you had to have patience to watch him because he'd just lie on his

2:03:24back and wait, wait, wait.

2:03:25Well, with Dan Severn he did because he had to catch him in a triangle.

2:03:29Right. And he eventually tapped him and no one even understand what was going on.

2:03:32Like, why is he? He's got his legs wrapped around him?

2:03:34What the hell is going on?

2:03:35Exactly. And then all of a sudden Dan Severn's tapping out.

2:03:38You're like, this is crazy.

2:03:39So a man who weighed literally a hundred pounds more than him or close to

2:03:44it. Right. On top of him and Hoist beat him.

2:03:46Well, Dan Severn didn't appear to have any finishing moves.

2:03:49Like, he was thinking, I got you on your back.

2:03:50I've pinned you. I've won the wrestling match.

2:03:52He would kind of give you little noogies and knuckle sandwiches.

2:03:55Right. But then, of course, eventually that anaconda comes in and either chokes you out

2:03:59or takes your arm. Well, no one understood jiu -jitsu until Hoist came around, you

2:04:04know, other than the Brazilians.

2:04:05And he was his dad, wasn't it?

2:04:05His dad that introduced it to the family?

2:04:07His dad and his uncle.

2:04:10So it was Carlos Gracie and Elio Gracie, who were the real founders of Brazilian

2:04:15jiu -jitsu. And then Carlson Gracie.

2:04:17Okay. And those guys were the pioneers.

2:04:19And they were having no rules fights in the 1930s and 40s.

2:04:23Wow. Yeah. And did they bring it over from Japan?

2:04:27Maeda brought it over from Japan and they taught the Gracies.

2:04:31And then, you know, Elio Gracie famously had a match with Kimura, who was a

2:04:38Japanese judoka who broke Elio's arm with a Kimura.

2:04:43And that's how that technique.

2:04:45That's why it's called a Kimura.

2:04:47Really? Yeah, in catch wrestling, they call it a double wrist lock.

2:04:50Okay. But we call it a Kimura because Kimura broke Elio Gracie's arm with this.

2:04:56Right. Elio just refused to tap, and it's like, and eventually it snapped his arm.

2:05:01Wow, that's incredible. You know, they're having these long no -rules fights in Brazil long

2:05:06before anybody had any idea what MMA was in America.

2:05:10And then Hoyce's brother, Hickson, who was the best out of all of them.

2:05:15Hickson was fighting people when he was 18 in like these big arenas.

2:05:20Really? In Brazil, yeah. Unbelievable.

2:05:22And then I guess Dana White brought it in with UFC.

2:05:27No, it wasn't Dana. There was another organization before Zufa owned the UFC.

2:05:34And this other organization, they started it with Horry and Gracie.

2:05:38So Horry and Gracie was the guy who founded the UFC.

2:05:42Okay. And originally they were talking about putting like a moat around the cage and

2:05:46having crocodiles in it and shit.

2:05:47They wanted it to be like completely insane.

2:05:50Because what it was for Horry, Horry is a brilliant man.

2:05:54And for him, what he wanted was to promote jujitsu.

2:05:58And he's like, this is gonna be the best way to open up schools all

2:06:01over the country and to show this art that my father had created.

2:06:04Right. So they had really taken some of the ground techniques of judo and really

2:06:10refined them to a razor sharp edge.

2:06:13And also one of the things that helped a lot was that Ilio was a

2:06:16small man. He was only like 145 pounds.

2:06:19And so he had to use only technique and leverage.

2:06:22He couldn't rely on brute strength.

2:06:24Interesting. And so it was one of the best sort of advertisements is to have

2:06:30Hoist, who was also fairly small, he was only 175 pounds, beat all these big

2:06:35giant muscle bound guys with pure technique.

2:06:38That's amazing. Because they didn't understand what he was doing.

2:06:40And he was like, this is gonna be brilliant.

2:06:41This is gonna... And it worked.

2:06:42I mean, the name Gracie and jujitsu are synonymous.

2:06:47It's everywhere now. Like we even have them in Canada where these schools will have

2:06:50the Gracie name. And obviously they have no attachment to Gracie's, the Brazilian Gracie's.

2:06:56But everybody wants to learn the Gracie style.

2:06:58Well, they probably do have a, like Gracie Baja, which is a huge affiliate of

2:07:03gyms. They're all over the country, the world.

2:07:05They're everywhere. Are they good?

2:07:06Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. It's very difficult to have a bad jujitsu gym today.

2:07:12Why is that? Because they're so competitive?

2:07:14It's too competitive. Okay. There's too many good people.

2:07:16There's too many good gyms.

2:07:18Like in Austin alone. Austin alone has like 10 amazing jujitsu schools.

2:07:22Is that right? Oh, yeah.

2:07:23Do you go, do you go and roll quite often still?

2:07:25There's a place right up the street.

2:07:26Okay. 10th Planet Jujitsu, which is the school that I started with.

2:07:29Okay. In California. Well, I started with the Machop.

2:07:31Well, I actually started with Hicks and Gracie.

2:07:32I started, I started with Hicks and Gracie.

2:07:35And then I went to Carlson Gracie.

2:07:36And then I, and that was just because I didn't know there was any difference

2:07:40in the Gracie's. And then Carlson Gracie was closer to my house.

2:07:42I'm like, oh, I'll go to this Gracie place.

2:07:44It's closer. That's when I was a white belt.

2:07:45I didn't know anything. And then when they closed, when that gym closed, then I

2:07:50went to Jean -Jacques Machado's.

2:07:52And so I started training there in 1998.

2:07:54And that was, that was in the Valley in California.

2:07:58But then one of Jean -Jacques black belts, my best friend, Eddie Bravo, he started

2:08:0310th Planet Jujitsu. And then I trained there as well.

2:08:07Okay. And in Canada, we see a lot of places where they do Muay Thai

2:08:11and Jujitsu. So you get your striking and your grappling all in one studio.

2:08:1510th Planet here has a Muay Thai program.

2:08:16Oh, is that right? Yeah.

2:08:17So that's common now. A lot of those gyms have that.

2:08:19And you went to your first, as a commentator, you did it like for free,

2:08:22didn't you? No, no. I got paid in the early days, in the 90s, in

2:08:271997, but it wasn't much.

2:08:29Okay. I was losing money.

2:08:30But when the UFC was purchased by Zufa in 2001, that was when I was

2:08:36on Fear Factor. Ah, right.

2:08:37And I met Dana White, and I became friends with him, and he asked me

2:08:42as a favor to do commentary on this one show that they had, UFC 37

2:08:48and a half. It was on Fox Sports, whatever it was.

2:08:52There was a cable channel.

2:08:53So it was Best Damn Sports Show, period.

2:08:56Right. This UFC show. And he said, would you do me a favor and just

2:08:59do commentary on this one event?

2:09:00Right. And I said, okay, I'll do it for this one.

2:09:02And he's like, I want you to do it again.

2:09:04And then I was like, okay.

2:09:06So I was like, I just wanted to do it for fun.

2:09:09Right. For me, I like going to the fights, and I like going with my

2:09:13friends and having a good time.

2:09:15And I did like the first 15 of them for free.

2:09:18Really? I knew they were hemorrhaging money, and I didn't need any money.

2:09:22But you loved it. You loved being there.

2:09:23He was like a kid in a candy store.

2:09:25Well, I also was very happy to try to promote this thing.

2:09:28Because for me, it was the ultimate expression of martial arts.

2:09:32Like, we need to find out what's the best style.

2:09:34Right. And I had kind of, I had been so engrossed in that world in

2:09:39Japan with Pride and all these other organizations that they had over there.

2:09:43It's like, what happens if an alligator fights with a tiger?

2:09:45What happens if a lion fights with a bear?

2:09:47We've got to match them up and find out.

2:09:49Well, it's humans versus humans.

2:09:51Right. It's just style. Muay Thai versus karate.

2:09:55Because you didn't want to waste your time doing something that didn't work.

2:09:57Right. And there was a lot of people that wasted their time doing stuff that

2:10:00didn't work. And we didn't really know what that was until the UFC came along.

2:10:05And then we're like, oh.

2:10:06And now, the evolution of martial arts from 1993 when the UFC started to 2026.

2:10:12In those years, martial arts have evolved more than they have in the last 30

2:10:18,000 years. Right. Well, it's like the gap between theory and practice.

2:10:22Yes. And like Bruce Lee, when he, he started with Wing Chun, but he said

2:10:29that a lot of it was just ornamental.

2:10:31And he called it dry land swimming.

2:10:34It's like, you know, you wouldn't actually do that in a fight.

2:10:36And then he got into a lot of contention with the scholars of the art

2:10:42form. It's a very beautiful art form, Wing Chun.

2:10:45But I don't know if it, I can't imagine it works that well.

2:10:48Well, it is. Wing Chun is effective.

2:10:50There's a lot of techniques in Wing Chun.

2:10:59Wing Chun in Muay Thai, or in an MMA fight, but you have to know

2:11:04everything, that's the reality of it, it's like Taekwondo, like Taekwondo is not effective by

2:11:09itself in an MMA fight, but if you know MMA and you know Taekwondo, then

2:11:14you could do like what Edson Barboza did to Terry Edom and knock him out

2:11:17with a wheel kick in spectacular fashion, like it's learning all the techniques.

2:11:22Right. Like he has some Muay Thai, some karate, some.

2:11:25Yes. That's what MMA is.

2:11:28Mixed martial arts. I mean, it's like you take all, and that's Bruce Lee's philosophy.

2:11:33Absorb what's useful. Right. He was the real first mixed martial artist.

2:11:37And when it was very dangerous to do that.

2:11:39Right. Because people hated him.

2:11:41I mean, they would attack him.

2:11:42He would have, he would have to have fights with people because they thought that

2:11:46he was disrespecting their art.

2:11:47Right. And he combined Western boxing and wrestling.

2:11:51He learned judo from Gene LaBelle.

2:11:53He learned things from everybody.

2:11:55He learned karate, savate. He learned all these different martial arts and was absorbing what's

2:12:00useful and putting his own.

2:12:01So Jeet Kune Do, his style was really the first mixed martial arts style.

2:12:06Is that right? Yeah. Do people use it anymore?

2:12:08Well, yeah, there's Jeet Kune Do schools.

2:12:10Sure. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I mean, a lot of what Krav Maga is, the

2:12:15Israeli martial art, is like kind of a, combination of a combination of things along

2:12:19the same lines of the way Bruce Lee did it.

2:12:22Is it, is Krav Maga a good, effective martial arts system?

2:12:26Every martial arts system is effective if you have a great instructor.

2:12:30Okay. Right. But on their own, like the best styles are the really strong styles

2:12:38like Jiu Jitsu, Muay Thai, wrestling.

2:12:39Those are the best, Western boxing.

2:12:41Those are the best styles on their own.

2:12:43Okay. But what Krav Maga is, is a combination of all those styles.

2:12:47And so if you have a great instructor in Krav Maga, yeah, you'll, you'll learn

2:12:52great Muay Thai, you'll learn great Jiu Jitsu.

2:12:54It's essentially mixed martial arts, but with a lot of emphasis on real world applications,

2:13:00street fights, you know, dirty stuff like eye gouging, you know, poking people in the

2:13:05eye, kicking them in the nuts.

2:13:06Yikes. Stuff that works. But that's what you, like, you see it in an MMA

2:13:10fight all the time. A guy gets poked in the eye, he's like, hey, hang

2:13:12on. And he has to stop.

2:13:13Isn't that against the rules?

2:13:15Yeah, this guy's getting punched and, it's against the rules.

2:13:16So this guy's getting punched and kicked and, look, Tom Aspinall, he was in the

2:13:21heavyweight title fight and he got eye poked in the first round.

2:13:24He's had to have two surgeries since then on his eyes.

2:13:27And he hasn't been able to fight.

2:13:28They had to stop the fight in the first round from an eye poke.

2:13:30Oh my God. It's very effective.

2:13:32But in Krav Maga, they're like, go for the eye.

2:13:34Bang. Because in a real world fight for your life scenario, it's a good technique.

2:13:38If you're in a war, I mean, it's for the Israeli military, I think.

2:13:41Exactly. So they have to prepare for unusual situations where you're trying to survive in

2:13:47a situation where your weapon has been removed and you're just trying to fight for

2:13:53your life. Exactly. And you're in a situation with hand -to -hand combat.

2:13:56You need to learn how, you need to know every, if a guy takes you

2:14:00down, you can't be lost.

2:14:02Oh, we have to get back up so I can fight.

2:14:03No, you have to be able to fight on the ground.

2:14:05And that's the idea of it.

2:14:06Like incorporate jujitsu, incorporate leg kicks, Muay Thai, Western boxing, even Jeet Kune Do techniques,

2:14:14even Wing Chun techniques. Really?

2:14:15There's a lot of hand trapping and things in Wing Chun that can be very

2:14:19effective in a fight. It looks really cool what they do with that wooden dummy.

2:14:24Uh -huh. Yeah. It looks...

2:14:25Well, there's... Exactly. I've never really got into that.

2:14:28But if you do get into that, you'll learn blocking techniques and you'll learn...

2:14:32That actually work? Yeah, sure.

2:14:34Okay. But you... They'll work if you know the other stuff.

2:14:38Right. They won't work if a guy just shoots a double on you and takes

2:14:40you down and starts pounding and you don't know what to do when you're on

2:14:43the bottom. Right. You have to know how to...

2:14:45And this is what really MMA has taught the world.

2:14:49It's like you have to be able to defend yourself everywhere.

2:14:52Standing up, on the ground, you have to be effective in all the realms.

2:14:56Right. But still, we have a lot of people that are pure specialists that do

2:15:00really well in mixed martial arts because they're so good in one area.

2:15:05Like Alex Pereira, who is the middleweight champion, light heavyweight champion, and now he's going

2:15:10up to heavyweight. He's going to be fighting at the White House card.

2:15:13Alex Pereira is one of the greatest kickboxers of all time.

2:15:16Right. He's a two -division world champion and kickboxer.

2:15:18But his style is all kickboxing, but he just developed takedown defense.

2:15:23He can do it all.

2:15:24He can do it all.

2:15:25But he doesn't submit anybody.

2:15:26If you're fighting him, you're going to get...

2:15:28It's going to be a stand -up fight.

2:15:30Right. Unless you can take him down, he's not going to try to take you

2:15:32down. He's going to try to fuck you up.

2:15:34He's going to try to knock you into another dimension.

2:15:36Thanks for the warning. I'll try to avoid the guy fighting him on the street.

2:15:40The funniest thing I ever saw was there's this video of John Jones on the

2:15:44street somewhere. And he bumped into...

2:15:47He was talking and he leaned on some guy's motorcycle.

2:15:50I think he might have been in Asia or something.

2:15:52The guy had no idea who he was.

2:15:54And he started screaming at him.

2:15:56Oh, no. And John said, I'm very, very sorry.

2:15:59And he turned around. He ran away like he was terrified.

2:16:02And it was obviously he wasn't in any danger.

2:16:04But it was so hilarious that this guy had no idea who he was picking

2:16:07a fight with. That's hilarious.

2:16:09The guy has no idea.

2:16:11His life flashed before his eyes.

2:16:12But he took it well because he was like, you know, I don't have anything

2:16:15to prove. Yeah. John's not the type of guy that would do anything to...

2:16:18I mean, also, what a lawsuit, you know?

2:16:21Oh, yeah. Your hands are weapons.

2:16:23I mean, his whole body's a weapon.

2:16:24Yeah. But most of those guys are really nice guys in real life.

2:16:28Is that right? Yeah. Because they get all their aggression out.

2:16:31They don't have anything to prove.

2:16:32They're not the type of...

2:16:34They know what they can do.

2:16:35They don't have to prove it to anybody.

2:16:36Well, you should come to Winnipeg.

2:16:38They have a fight coming up.

2:16:39I think it's in... I think it's in April.

2:16:42It's in April. A UFC in Winnipeg?

2:16:44Yeah. I've avoided UFCs in Canada.

2:16:46Well, come on up. I've avoided it just because of the government, just because of

2:16:49what was going on as a protest.

2:16:50I was like, this is so fucked.

2:16:52Well, we'll come back up and...

2:16:53Well, if you win, I'll go up there.

2:16:54Well, we should get you up before then.

2:16:56You become prime minister. I promise I'll do all the UFC events that they have

2:17:00in Canada. We need you up in Canada to come do one of your comedy

2:17:03shows, and it would be great for Canadian tourism.

2:17:06I used to love going up there.

2:17:07I used to love going to Massey Hall.

2:17:08Yeah. I used to... Toronto?

2:17:10Yeah. I love performing there.

2:17:12I did, um... You used to do Montreal.

2:17:14And how old were you when you were in Montreal?

2:17:18Oh, I started, I think the first time I was up there, I was like

2:17:2125. Such a beautiful city, eh?

2:17:23Yeah, 26. It's gorgeous there.

2:17:24Oh, I loved it up there.

2:17:25Quebec is lovely. It's amazing.

2:17:26Beautiful province. Amazing food. Shout out to Joe Beef, one of my favorite restaurants in

2:17:31the world that's in Montreal.

2:17:32Yeah, they're, Montreal's a great place and you should come out to the prairies too.

2:17:37Go to the Calgary Stampede.

2:17:39I've heard that's awesome. Oh, it's amazing.

2:17:40I've been to Edmonton. I've been to Alberta.

2:17:43Yeah. Yeah, I've performed in Edmonton a few times and I've hunted in Alberta.

2:17:48Where? Well, my friends John and Jen Rivet, they have a guide.

2:17:56I mean, they guide people up in Northern Alberta.

2:18:01It's all like, you know, black bear hunting.

2:18:04So it's like. There's a lot of great hunting.

2:18:06I don't hunt myself, but there's a ton of great hunting, a lot of hunters

2:18:09in Alberta. Oh, yeah. Well, there's talk about Alberta separating.

2:18:12That won't happen. What was that about?

2:18:14It won't happen. Some people are frustrated, but they, you know, there's some legitimate frustrations.

2:18:21But at the end of the day, Canada's going to be united and Albertans, I'm

2:18:26born and raised in Alberta and Albertans are seriously patriotic.

2:18:30Very patriotic. Yeah, they're great people, hardworking.

2:18:33Some of the nicest people you've ever met across.

2:18:35They are great people in Alberta.

2:18:36Hardy. They are a hardy people.

2:18:38It's cold up there. It is cold.

2:18:40You know how to survive.

2:18:41Exactly. You've got to be tough to survive the cold in Canada.

2:18:44Carve a country like we have out of that cold weather on that big open

2:18:47land. But people just keep on going.

2:18:51And Alberta's got a real kind of rugged individualism.

2:18:55Yes. And people love their agriculture.

2:18:59There's great ranches in Alberta, beautiful grasslands in Saskatchewan.

2:19:04Doesn't Brock Lesnar have a place up there?

2:19:06I didn't know that. I think Brock Lesnar bought land in Alberta.

2:19:10Really? I think he owns a ranch up there.

2:19:11Actually, I had heard that from somebody.

2:19:13I've never seen him. He fell in love with it.

2:19:15Well, he's a big hunter as well.

2:19:16Right. He fell in love with it up there because it's just, it's so magnificent.

2:19:20It's so gorgeous. It's a great country.

2:19:22It's a big country. The Canadian Rockies are so dense and beautiful and you've got

2:19:25wolves and bears and moose and everything up there.

2:19:27It's an amazing country. The Canadian Rockies are spectacular as well.

2:19:32They're a worldwide attraction. You go to Lake Louise, it looks like a tropical lake

2:19:37because it's all this runoff from the mountain melt and you'd think you were in

2:19:42the tropics because it's this turquoise green.

2:19:44That's where I grew up.

2:19:45I love Calgary. I love Southern Alberta.

2:19:48That's really my home. And so you've got to come to the Stampede.

2:19:52The greatest outdoor show on earth.

2:19:53A lot of Texans go up for the Stampede because it's a rodeo.

2:19:56It's a huge rodeo. Yeah.

2:19:58People don't think cowboy Canada.

2:20:00They don't think of that, but yeah.

2:20:02Calgary, they've got some serious cowboys there.

2:20:04No, they really do. Yeah.

2:20:05Look, I love Canada. I just...

2:20:07If you did your comedy show in Calgary, you'd get a massive turnout.

2:20:11It would be great. Think it over.

2:20:13I was supposed to be up there before COVID.

2:20:15I was supposed to do a show up there for 420 for April 20th.

2:20:20I was going to do it in Vancouver.

2:20:22That's another great city. Every year I would do these 420 shows, like these, you

2:20:28know, 420 is the marijuana number.

2:20:29And Canada, now you guys have legal marijuana too.

2:20:33I've been legal for 10 years.

2:20:34Which they should have in America.

2:20:35It's so ridiculous. They just recently decided to make it Schedule 3.

2:20:39Is it state by state?

2:20:42Yes. Okay. It's legal in a lot of states, but it's still not legal federally.

2:20:46It's goofy. If alcohol is legal, marijuana is far safer.

2:20:49It should be legal. It's ridiculous.

2:20:51It's also a personal freedom thing.

2:20:53Leave people alone. It's like no one's robbing banks, smoking weed, and fucking killing neighbors.

2:20:58It's crazy. That's a personal choice thing.

2:21:01It's not heroin. It's not opiates.

2:21:04It's not like maybe you shouldn't do it if you have mental health problems, right?

2:21:08But there's a lot of people that just like take a pot gummy and go

2:21:11to bed and make some sleep better.

2:21:13Like leave them alone. Like leave people alone.

2:21:16Let people have a glass of whiskey.

2:21:17Let people have a glass of wine with dinner.

2:21:19Leave them alone. Like stop coming up with laws where you can impose your values

2:21:26and your morals and your judgments on other people.

2:21:29Let them have – make their own personal – look, if you want to eat

2:21:31a fucking cheeseburger, eat a cheeseburger.

2:21:33You know, if you want to go and have five Big Macs, you should be

2:21:36able to. I don't think you should do it, but I don't think there should

2:21:39be a law stopping you.

2:21:40And I think that should apply to a lot of things in life and we'd

2:21:44be a lot better off.

2:21:45Well, the bottom line is if you cannot trust a man to govern himself, how

2:21:50can you trust him to govern for others?

2:21:52Like if you think that human nature is so flawed that people cannot make decisions

2:21:58for themselves, then how could you possibly trust human nature to make decisions for other

2:22:03people, to impose decisions on their lives?

2:22:06And who watches the watchmen?

2:22:08We're constantly told we need to be kind of guided by these people from ivory

2:22:13towers. But who are these angels anyway?

2:22:15They're just human beings like everyone else.

2:22:17So when you give them more power and more – you give them the power

2:22:19to impose their will on people, then that ultimately gets abused.

2:22:23Yes. So even – you're right.

2:22:25Even when somebody is doing something that I don't agree with and I would think

2:22:28it would be better for all of us if they didn't do it, the mal

2:22:31that is done by giving me the power to impose my decision -making on them

2:22:35is worse than the benefit of trying to direct them towards a better decision.

2:22:40Well said. That's my philosophy.

2:22:42That's why I like you.

2:22:43Well, that's where I come from.

2:22:44You make a lot of sense.

2:22:45It's pretty simple. I think all the best things in life are simple.

2:22:48You know, we overcomplicate things.

2:22:50Government is way too complicated.

2:22:52You know, I think we need to get back to the simplicity.

2:22:56The greatest speech in the English language was Abraham Lincoln's Gettysburg Address, 271 words.

2:23:03You know, Einstein compressed mass and energy into a five -character equation.

2:23:12You know, Bruce Lee was an advocate of simplicity.

2:23:15Like, simplicity is a virtue, and I think we have to get back to simplicity,

2:23:19especially in government. Simpler, clearer, easier to manage.

2:23:24That's the kind of the philosophical take I pursue.

2:23:28That's the kind of the philosophical take I pursue.

2:23:28Well, I appreciate that. And I think like that philosophy and that perspective from a

2:23:34leader is what we need in this world, you know, and I think leaders have

2:23:40to have humility because the problem is that if you are an egomaniac and you're

2:23:44in power anywhere in the world, then you're going to want to just continually impose

2:23:48new rules and laws to make yourself bigger.

2:23:51Whereas if you believe in freedom, then you have to take, you have to be

2:23:55able to say to yourself, I don't know better for this other person.

2:23:58He knows better what's for him.

2:24:00And, you know, it's, it's hard, but politicians have to think that they have to

2:24:05trust the people. But, you know, nobody wants to have, he left people alone on

2:24:09their gravestone. They want to think, oh, he built this.

2:24:12He, he imposed that. He made this grand initiative that he imposed on the people

2:24:17in order to have a legacy.

2:24:18But my legacy is just to let other people build their legacies in their own

2:24:22lives. I think the idea of forging a legacy based on controlling people and imposing

2:24:27your will is ludicrous. Exactly.

2:24:30Yeah. And the problem is history is littered with people like that.

2:24:33Absolutely. Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan.

2:24:36There's so many people that imposed their will and left a legacy, but is that

2:24:40good? I don't think it is.

2:24:42And it's also, they're dead.

2:24:44They are, exactly. It doesn't matter.

2:24:46It doesn't matter. Nobody walked by, walked by one of those magnificent tombs in, in

2:24:51Petra and said, boy, I'd really like to be inside there.

2:24:53Exactly. What, what is happening while you're alive is what's really significant and the most,

2:24:59the, the most impactful thing.

2:25:01Like, do well, do good for the people.

2:25:03And I think your message resonates with me.

2:25:07Thank you. And if I was a Canadian, I would vote for you 100%.

2:25:10Thank you. Thank you for that.

2:25:11Well, it's, it's, you know, it's a privilege to do this work and I'm, I

2:25:15consider it very humbling. And I'm very proud to be Canadian and to take the

2:25:20message of Canada here to our American friends.

2:25:22Well, I'm glad you're here doing that.

2:25:24And I think this is going to have a big impact.

2:25:27Absolutely. And I really hope it moves the needle up in Canada.

2:25:30Absolutely. And down here, we got to get these tariffs gone.

2:25:33Get the tariffs gone. Well, let's work it out.

2:25:36Right on. Work it out.

2:25:37And if you win, I'm coming up there.

2:25:39I promise. Well, we're going to try to get you up there earlier.

2:25:41I'm going to keep working on you.

2:25:42Okay. And you look at that, that maple leaf on your new kettlebell every day.

2:25:45Eventually, we're going to, we're going to work subliminally into your subconscious and get you

2:25:50up. Well, look, like I said, you don't have to sell me on Canada.

2:25:52I love Canada. And I love that gift.

2:25:55So thank you so much.

2:25:55Thank you very much. Thank you for being here.

2:25:57Thank you. It was awesome.

2:25:58All right. Thank you. Thank you.

2:26:00Bye, everybody. Bye. Bye. Bye.

2:26:06Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.

2:26:12Bye. Bye.

#2470 - Pierre Poilievre