The Manosphere Report

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3:04That's odoo .com. Hey, you guys are listening to the Tudor Dixon podcast.

3:09I'm Tudor Dixon. And as you know, if you've been listening, you know I have

3:13four daughters. So I've been to plenty of children's dance recitals.

3:17And you probably have also been to a dance recital or a competition at some

3:21point. But has it ever felt a little off to you?

3:25Because I actually have had this experience where we've seen, mostly it's like the middle

3:30school and the high school students that are performing a dance that seems, well, not,

3:35for lack of a better term, over -sexualized.

3:38And I thought, like, maybe I'm imagining this, but I remember at the time, my

3:43girls, my... So I was sitting there with my husband and he looked at the

3:47dances that were being performed on the stage and he goes, I feel uncomfortable.

3:53Like, I feel like I shouldn't be here.

3:55And that was a moment where...

3:57Yeah. My dance class had always felt like a place where it was like mom

4:00and daughters and then I realized in that moment it should not be a place

4:07where when the girls are dancing in front of the dads, it's uncomfortable.

4:11So I thought maybe I was alone in this, but I recently heard about a

4:15woman who is kind of fighting that fight of over -sexualizing her kids.

4:19And I thought it was so important for you to hear.

4:21So I want to bring Mary Bodden in to join us today.

4:25She's not only a dance educator, but she's an outspoken advocate for kids.

4:29And she actually has her own foundation called Dance.

4:33It's Dance Awareness, No Child Exploited.

4:36Mary, thank you for joining me.

4:38I'm so happy to be here.

4:40So I was reading about what you're doing and I honestly had this situation where

4:45I was like, it's not, it's like a whole different culture.

4:47And if you have never been involved in dance, but you have children or you

4:51have grandchildren, you need to understand that there is safe dance.

4:54Dance to me is very important.

4:56My, just for you to get a little history of me, my grandmother was a

5:00dancer her whole life. When I was a kid, she would tell us about how

5:04her mother took her to nursing homes and had her dance.

5:08She danced all the way up until her death.

5:11She taught dance when she was in retirement.

5:14She taught dance to other women.

5:16Dance was a huge part of her life.

5:17My sister was a dancer.

5:19My sister danced all through college.

5:21She did competitive dance all through high school.

5:24There she is .��く though.

5:24I'm not. I'm Well, dance is critical, I think, for I think it's a great

5:28place for women to come together and learn, learn a skill, become a team.

5:34But it's been kind of over -sexualized lately.

5:38So tell us how you saw dance changing over time and what we need to

5:43look out for as parents.

5:44Well, first, I want your listeners and viewers to know that I'm a dance educator.

5:50I have a master's and a BA, highly trained in Cicchetti Ballet, and modern in

5:59my Bachelor of Arts degree.

6:01So I love dance, and I think that's the important thing, just like you.

6:08Dance and movement is good medicine.

6:10But there's been a cultural shift from healthy educational children's dance to harmful, hyper -sexualized

6:19children's dance in adult costumes, choreography, and music.

6:23And we've gone from a culture of innocence to a battlefield of hyper -sexualized content.

6:30And actually, this doesn't come from the dance industry.

6:34It really comes from the internet, media, and porn industry, who are using dance as

6:41a portal to make money and to really exchange the innocence of little people for

6:51trauma, actually. Well, and that was something that I thought was so important, as obviously

6:59we're talking about the Epstein files.

7:00We're talking about these girls that were groomed and pulled into this life.

7:05And there is a reality out there, you know, for people who are thinking, you

7:09know, once you got Epstein and once you get everybody in these files, child predators

7:14are gone. That's crazy. Okay.

7:16This is a, we are the, I think, the number two nation in the world

7:20for child trafficking. And over -sexualization, it leads to that.

7:25And so these people are actually finding girls on the internet that are, in some

7:30cases, just innocently being posted by the dance company or their parents.

7:34That's right. But if they're in this situation where they're doing these moves, it's, it

7:39is, it is just a predator's haven.

7:43It is a predator's haven.

7:45And dance is unregulated. And so anybody can open up a dance studio.

7:50You don't have to have a dance background.

7:53Well, that is an interesting thing because oftentimes we say, like, we want to get

7:58rid of regulation. And in, in our state, I know everything is so regulated.

8:02You can't cut hair if you don't have a license.

8:05And you never think about dance because you, and we haven't had this kind of

8:11issue with dance. But wow, we really should know who's teaching our daughters.

8:15I am. I'm with you on the regulation.

8:18I'm not, I'm not a strong proponent that everything has to be regulated, except with

8:24children. I do think we need to be really careful who gets to work with

8:29children. And just a benchmark of something we need in the dance industry is just

8:35a background check. We don't even have that.

8:38So we, we have some work to do, and I'm an educator, and I love

8:44dance. So I'm not going to tell anybody not to sign their kids up for

8:48dance because it's so great.

8:50All the research shows that it integrates mind, body, and spirit.

8:54The brain research shows it's wonderful.

8:58Psychological research shows it's wonderful if, and only if it's healthy dance.

9:04So I use the terms healthy dance and harmful dance.

9:08And I will tell you, all the research goes the other way.

9:12When children are exposed to hyper -sexualized adult content put into adult costumes, choreography, and

9:21music, the research shows the exact opposite effect takes place.

9:27And so we really need to make informed choices.

9:30That's one of the educational goals of dance is we produce all kinds of research

9:37-based materials that help adults who love kids, and most of us do, to make

9:44informed choices so that they send their children to a dance studio that doesn't hyper

9:50-sexualize the children. And friends, viewers, just understand if your child is younger and they're

9:59not hyper -sexualizing her age group or his age group, if it's a boy, children

10:05watch older children, right? And so pretty soon a child begins to think that that's

10:13normal when they see older children hyper -sexualized.

10:17So I just want to stop you there because to the point of almost like

10:25for our girls, because we would go to these competitions, and then afterward, they send

10:29you the DVD, you know?

10:30So you get the whole competition on DVD.

10:32And my girls would sit and re -watch not their own performance, everybody's performance.

10:39So they are watching the older kids.

10:41Even if they're not in the room with them, once they go to that competition,

10:45that's who they look up to.

10:47They adore them. And brain research calls that mirror neurons.

10:51We call... copy what we see.

10:53So if we have healthy examples, we copy that.

10:57And if we have harmful examples, we copy that.

11:02So children are very, very vulnerable.

11:05So everybody needs to take note of this and make sure that you check out

11:11what kind of dance studio your child is involved with.

11:16And, you know, hyper -sexualized content takes place here too.

11:21By the way, that's my two granddaughters because all kids are uploading TikTok videos, taking

11:29these dance videos, putting them on all kinds of social media platforms.

11:34And as you earlier mentioned, predators see this.

11:37They upload this content to porn sites.

11:40And sometimes, I'm not going to say every time a child uploads their dance video.

11:47They're going to be contacted by a predator.

11:49But it's happening more and more and more.

11:53So if you think it's not happening, I had a major wake -up call last

11:57night when I was putting my daughter to bed.

11:59I have a 14 -year -old and we were talking right before bedtime, which I

12:03find is like the time when your kids start to tell you everything.

12:06They're tired. They want to stay up.

12:07They want to tell you everything that happened, right?

12:09So my 14 -year -old says to me, hey, I'm worried about one of my

12:14friends because she keeps posting thirst traps on TikTok.

12:18And I almost fell off the bed.

12:20I was like, how do you even know that word?

12:22Like, what did you just say to me?

12:25And I'm like, explain what you mean by that.

12:28And here on TikTok, you have a 14 -year -old, which my kids don't have

12:33TikTok. But she says, I said, how do you know?

12:37And she said, well, she shows me and says, look at the thirst trap I

12:40posted. And I said, wait a minute.

12:41Whoa, whoa, whoa. Are you telling me that she genuinely uses that word?

12:47And she said, yeah, mom, do you know what it is?

12:49I'm like, why do you know what it is?

12:51But if you think your 14 -year -old doesn't know, you're dead wrong.

12:56Yeah. Yes, exactly. They all know all kinds of things.

13:01And we have to begin to address this.

13:03You can't back off. If you love your child, you have to really take note

13:09of what's going on in the culture and looking around the culture.

13:13And you're going to see that porn is the wallpaper of our kids' lives.

13:17So whether they take dance in the dance studio performing this stuff, or it's outside

13:22the dance studio, as their friends share videos, as their friends are asked to do

13:29certain dance moves, as they go to movies, as they read magazines, as they're on

13:35their phones, they're all getting hyper -sexualized content in adult costumes, choreography, and music.

13:43And so friends, as caring adults, we have to stand up for this issue.

13:48And that's why I founded danceawareness .com.

13:51By the way, we have a free e -book download.

13:55It's only 11 pages. It's free.

13:58And it will help a caring adult know what is the new trend in children's

14:03dance, how to choose a healthy dance studio, how to avoid...

14:07That is what I love.

14:08You go to a map.

14:09You can actually put your town into the website and find...

14:13Well, that's the healthy dance directory.

14:15That is great. Because you've already done the research then, so you know that...

14:22And I found one close to us.

14:24I went in and I checked it out and I was like, okay, I want

14:26to see. And I found one close to us, which I'm in a small town.

14:30So it made me actually...

14:32I was like, wow, this is pretty extensive because I'm in a small town in

14:36Michigan and I was able to find a dance studio that was in your directory,

14:39which I think is amazing.

14:41And I say that because I agree, I think music and dance and learning to

14:47take care of your body, because a lot of what dance is, is also self

14:50-care to make sure that you are aware of your body, to make sure you

14:54are... And that can be used for so many good things.

14:59Yeah. Yeah. You know, you're exactly right.

15:02And you know, I was mentioning the free e -book download, only 11 pages to

15:06help people choose a dance studio because caring adults are often clueless.

15:11But we also have what you just mentioned, the Healthy Dance Directory.

15:15It's free. It's the first ever state -by -state listing of healthy dance studios.

15:22It's now gone international. We're getting nominations of healthy dance studios from England and Australia

15:28and Canada, all over. And friends, it is free.

15:33So if you're looking for a healthy dance studio that doesn't hyper -sexualize, this will

15:40provide a wonderful experience for your child, look in this free directory.

15:44But I also have to encourage people, we are a non -profit.

15:49We don't have a lot of financial resources.

15:53What financial resources we do have are put into the website so that we can

15:59support dance studios and caring adults who care about this issue.

16:03So you can nominate a healthy dance studio.

16:07yourself. And it's free. So nominate a healthy dance studio.

16:14If you're listening to this podcast, our staff will take it from there.

16:18They have to agree. to our definition of healthy and harmful dance.

16:22And I'll share that a minute if I can.

16:25But after that, they're listed.

16:27So there's no cost for parents and there's no cost for dance studios.

16:33We're just trying to really shine a light on this issue.

16:37And we want kids in safe environments.

16:41Let's take a quick commercial break.

16:43We'll continue next on the Tudor Dixon podcast.

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20:21It's so important. It's something that, honestly, I had been seeing, and you say this

20:27about parents being aware. I had been seeing, but hadn't really internalized what I was

20:32seeing. Right. As a student that had been in dance as a kid, we were

20:37kind of traditionally went from learning ballet to actually performing ballet.

20:44And I see too much of the ballet part being cut out, and then it

20:48goes to like these, like you said, these sexualized dances that are incorporating ballet, but

20:54they're, it's different. It's like the kind of dance you would see a new girls

21:00group do in, on MTV.

21:03You know, this is not the kind of dance that I did as a kid.

21:06And it's not like the fundamentals of dance.

21:08And once you got, no, it isn't.

21:11Yeah. So once you get away from that, as a parent, you have to kind

21:13of go, is this best?

21:15You know what? My kids just, this will horrify you, and I don't even want

21:18to admit it, but my kids just started watching Dance Moms.

21:22Yeah. It's a horrible show.

21:24It's terrible. What in the world?

21:28Yeah. The, the instructor, uh, is abusive in my opinion.

21:33Very. Trauma. And, uh, you can see that in one episode.

21:38Uh, if you watch it, and I only watch it because I'm the founder of

21:42dance, uh, just like I watched the movie Cuties a couple of years ago.

21:47Uh, Don't watch that either.

21:48It's an awful show, and it exploits children and produces trauma in them.

21:57Let me just share, if I can, some simplified definitions and research so that your

22:05viewers, my new friends, my new besties, can go out and feel more confident.

22:12You know, this is a nuanced issue, and people get overwhelmed.

22:17So I have come up with a simplified definition for healthy and harmful dance that

22:22seems to be helpful. We have a more nuanced definition in our materials.

22:27It's very good. So you can find that for free on our website.

22:31But in healthy educational dance, children look like children, right?

22:37Now, that should be a given.

22:39But look for children looking like children in age -appropriate costumes, choreography, and music, usually

22:47accompanied by a great amount of smiling, happiness, joy.

22:53But in harmful, hyper -sexualized dance, children look like adults.

22:59In adult costumes, choreography, and music, usually accompanied by adult hairstyles and makeup, and they're

23:07not very happy. You're not going to see the same level of joy.

23:11You're going to see a lot of come -hither looks, a lot of sexualized movement.

23:17And so you can kind of spot the differences between healthy and harmful dance without

23:22being an expert, because children look like children, or children look like adults.

23:28So I hope that's helpful to your viewers.

23:31And I'll tell you, the American Psychological Association defines hyper -sexualized dance.

23:40Can I share that with your viewers?

23:43Yeah, absolutely. They say, and this is the APA, they say that a child is

23:48sexualized when they're valued only for their sexual appeal or behavior, when their physical attractiveness

23:56is equated with being sexy, when they're made into an object, or when sexuality is

24:03imposed on a child. And friends, a child would never come up with the sexualized

24:11moves on their own that we're seeing.

24:14Researcher Philip Adams calls it corporate pedophilia.

24:19Yeah, researcher Gail Dines calls it a pornified culture.

24:24That's why I mentioned the internet, media, and porn just a little bit ago.

24:31We are in a culture where sexuality is the wallpaper of our kids' lives.

24:37And so we have to take note, and we have to speak up and say

24:41something. You know, you hear that saying at the airport, you see something, say something.

24:46You can do that respectfully.

24:49It's because nobody has said anything, that this has been normalized, that children are being

24:56turned into many adults. And again, the outcome is trauma.

25:01It's trauma. When we teach women and some little boys, because they're getting sucked into

25:08this too, that externals and looking sexy like an adult is what your goal needs

25:16to be. The traumatic effects really produce human beings that are a shell of what

25:25they need to really grow and develop into.

25:30When children take healthy dance, it develops the whole person, mind, body, and spirit.

25:38So it's, as I said earlier, a wonderful, wonderful tool to help a child grow

25:45into what they need to be.

25:48Well, there's also the role of the parents, which I think we also maybe haven't

25:55focused on enough how to protect our kids.

25:57When we choose activities for them, we're so proud of them.

26:02We want to be telling everybody about it.

26:05And there's this new term that I had never heard before called sharenting.

26:09And it means that you're sharing videos of your kids online.

26:13You're sharing pictures of your kids online.

26:16And I've done it. When the girls were little, I shared pictures of them at

26:20their dance recitals. And, you know, they did look like children.

26:25They had their tutus on.

26:26But you think you're safe because you're on your page.

26:31And I think that's something we need to talk about.

26:34Not only is it that other people are seeing that, but also your kids are

26:38seeing that. And now we're hearing that one in three preteens is saying they want

26:43to be an influencer. So this can all lead to something that is very negative

26:49for your child's self -esteem.

26:51You know, it's really broadened and gone way beyond just posting a picture of your

26:57child on Facebook or another social media platform, which initially is very appropriate.

27:04But we live in a different age.

27:06And I can share with you, in 1983, the New York Times released an article

27:13called The Age of Childhood.

27:15childhood. And in that article, they talked about innocence.

27:18And they said, and this is way back in 1983, that we'd gone through a

27:23shift. We'd gone from an age of protection that is shielding children from adult issues

27:30to an age of preparation that is exposing children to adult issues.

27:36And you can see, if you take that thread of exposing children to adult issues,

27:42where we are in 2026.

27:46So it's something I don't think any parent thought about.

27:50And again, part of that is the internet exposure of this kind of content to

27:56children. Nobody ever dreamed would happen.

28:00So in dance awareness, we never point our finger at parents or adults or shame

28:08them. A lot of this has just happened so quickly.

28:13Yes. And so we don't have fingers to point at you and say you're a

28:17bad parent or a bad person.

28:19What we do have is education for you.

28:23So you know the differences between healthy and harmful dance.

28:27We are affiliated with the National Center on Sexual Exploitation in Washington, DC.

28:34So our research is outstanding.

28:36Again, I want to say, come on to our website and you can use all

28:40our free materials. We have a couple of four minute trailers that really do educate

28:46in a very short amount of time.

28:48They're also good to show to your kids and discuss it.

28:52There's nothing in them that you're going to be upset about seeing.

28:56Probably they've seen it way before you.

29:00Although we really try not to have so much in our trailers that you'd be

29:08embarrassed about. So you can use those.

29:11We have colleges, universities, high schools, churches using our materials to start the discussion.

29:19And you will be surprised.

29:21Your kids know a lot more than you do.

29:24Yeah, they do. And I do think that shows that are glorified, like the Dance

29:30Moms show, and if you haven't watched it, the concept is kind of that you

29:34have all these moms, they're very focused on their children's dance.

29:38Obviously, they're following the girls through dance.

29:40The instructor is very hard on these girls.

29:44And as you listen to it, I mean, the moms are like totally invested also

29:49in dance. And one of the episodes that they had on just the other day,

29:54the girl like, I don't know, she made a mistake.

29:56She goes and she is hiding behind a curtain crying.

29:59Of course, this is also for the cameras, but the kids are watching it thinking,

30:04well, this is real life.

30:05And the mom goes, well, I don't know why you're crying.

30:08Your life is not dance.

30:09And I think, but this is how you're portraying her life.

30:13She's on TV for dance.

30:15So yes, she does think her life is dance.

30:18And she is a child.

30:19I mean, we're talking about kids that are 10 and 12 years old.

30:23You're right. And you have a story about a young woman who danced from age

30:2912 to 16. And she says she was hypersexualized.

30:33And I say this because she talked about how when she was 12, she was

30:38dancing to Britney Spears' Slave for You when she was 13.

30:41It was Pussycat Dolls Buttons.

30:43And the choreography was twerking and wide open legs.

30:48And the comments from the dance instructor, which I think a lot of these, a

30:53lot of our dance schools, they have a main instructor and then they have a

30:57younger woman who is teaching other kids.

30:59And they are also watching these things.

31:02That's why you have to talk to your kids and understand because it can go

31:05to a dark place without.

31:08It can really go to a dark.

31:09Yeah. Because this young woman was being told dance sexier.

31:13And maybe if you lost your virginity, you would dance sexier.

31:17I mean, that was shocking to me.

31:18It's shocking and not totally shocking because I know that this can go, this can,

31:25it can catch fire so quickly in a group of young women, almost like, you

31:29know, when I was in college, they would say somebody can get an eating disorder

31:33and then it's kind of like a social contagion.

31:35But it's this, I think it's the same with sexualization.

31:38You're right. It has caught fire all through the country.

31:44And although I think some of the competitions are just fine, a lot of them

31:50award hyper -sexualized content. And so if what wins the competition is hyper -sexualized content,

31:59all the dance studios and all the parents want to have hyper -sexualized content because

32:07they all want to win.

32:09And so we need to get off this treadmill that winning is the only thing.

32:14It's not the only thing.

32:16Developing your heart, your mind, and your body, expressing beautiful things, beautiful concepts, and enjoying

32:25movement as the good medicine that it is, is where we need to lead children.

32:31There's plenty of time for different young women and men to decide they want to

32:39be a professional and compete.

32:41But there's a great time.

32:42and it's called childhood, where they need to get to have fun and explore movement

32:49and be a butterfly and, you know, wear a tutu and be in a June

32:56recital and just have a wonderful time and get flowers from grandpa and grandma and

33:04enjoy and not be tied in to being an adult and competing on an adult

33:11level. And again, that competition theme is going younger and younger and younger.

33:18Children are told they're not good enough at five years of age to move in

33:24a dance class. Give me a break.

33:27No, you're so right. So we actually had this conversation.

33:30This is why this is so fascinating to me, having four girls and they all

33:34stayed in dance up until middle school, but it was a similar situation where they

33:39felt like it was a place where they got put down rather than a place

33:43where they were built up.

33:44And that when I, when I read your story, I was like, oh my gosh,

33:48we experienced this. And my daughter just the other day, she said, you know what,

33:51mom, I would have stuck with dance had I not been told every day, if

33:55you could dance like your sister, maybe you would be good at this.

33:58And I think that is such a terrible way to be treated when you're little.

34:02Oh, she was little. Yeah.

34:04Yeah. That's an abusive message.

34:07Actually, right there. That shows me that whoever said that is not a dance educator.

34:13So you have to go to school, you have to learn what is called pedagogy.

34:18And it's a way to teach the art form that really informs and produces joy

34:27in a child. So anybody who is aware and educated would never say that kind

34:33of comment to a child.

34:36So can I share our educational goals?

34:39Yeah, absolutely. Please do. We, we have four of them, just so you all know.

34:44And again, I'm going to say that we are a free website, danceawareness .com.

34:49But we exist to shelter and to protect children from hypersexualized content in adult costumes,

35:00choreography, and music, and to protect the art of dance because hypersexualized content is not

35:07the art of dance. Then we exist to create free research materials to give caring

35:13adults, and that includes dance educators and parents and grandpas and grandmas all around the

35:22culture the information to know the differences between healthy and harmful dance.

35:29And then we exist to engage in respectful conversations with everybody because this issue is

35:36not understood without shaming or polarizing adults so that they can have a chance to

35:43reflect and hear about the research and the outcomes, and then to make informed choices.

35:50And then we exist to communicate the connection between the hypersexualization of children in adult

35:57costumes, choreography, and music, and the pornography industry.

36:03Because children are being groomed into all kinds of traumatic environments.

36:12So we need to speak up and stand up.

36:15And we are here to help and support dance studios that don't hypersexualize and caring

36:23adults who want the very best for the children around them.

36:27Let's take a quick commercial break.

36:29We'll continue next on the Tudor Dixon podcast.

36:32Hey, Ben Ferguson here. For the next 60 seconds, can you hit pause on your

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40:07You know, I love this story, and I say this again because dance was such

40:12an important part of my grandmother's life.

40:14And she passed it on to my sister, and my sister was such a phenomenal

40:20dancer. And I remember that clip, I'm sure you've seen it, of the woman who

40:24had dementia, and they played Swan Lake for her.

40:27She's been a ballerina, and you can see, yes, she lights up, and she immediately

40:33starts doing the moves to the song and to the ballet.

40:38It's just beautiful, and it should be a safe place.

40:43And that's why when I heard your story, I was like, I want to bring

40:46this to people because I think we are so used to not rocking the boat

40:51when we close some place.

40:52We are normalizing what is not normal.

40:55Yes, absolutely. And two, can I encourage you to tell your sister about dance awareness

41:01and have her nominate some healthy dance studios.

41:04If she's still in dance, she knows some.

41:07So they can be in our healthy dance directory, and all that happens is people

41:12know about healthy dance studios.

41:14So to all the listeners out there, please nominate dance studios that don't act or

41:20sexualize, and please look up our directory so that you can find them.

41:26So it's a both and.

41:28Yes, absolutely. I will do that, and I know our audience will do that, too.

41:32Thank you so much for sharing about this today.

41:34It's so important, and it's so wonderful for our girls' future and our boys' future

41:39and their confidence and their confidence in learning about themselves.

41:42So, Mary Lawton, thank you for coming on today.

41:46All right. I'm happy to do it.

41:48Absolutely. And thank you all for joining us on the Tudor Dixon podcast.

41:52As always, you can find us wherever you get your podcasts, the iHeartRadio app, Apple

41:56Podcasts, Rumble, or YouTube. Just check us out.

41:59Make sure you join us at Tudor Dixon.

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The Tudor Dixon Podcast: Exposing the Over-Sexualization of Kids in Dance